Bench Plateau Busting Tips?

[Altered Beast]

Unfortunately chest strength (not size) is my genetic weak point.

[Altered Beast]

I've accepted that I'm going to have to put in some serious work to get my BP up.

[Ir0nClad]

Eat more food and make smaller jumps on the bench, like 2.5lbs instead of 5lb jumps.

[theharjmann]

I also hate the fact that my squat and deadlift are each almost double my bench!
What do ya'll think?

thats normal

you recruit twice as many muslces in the deadlift than the bench so obviously you are gonna deadlift double what you can bench! if you cant deadlift double what you bench then that means your back and legs are too weak proportionally.

[Muscleguy93]

thats normal

you recruit twice as many muslces in the deadlift than the bench so obviously you are gonna deadlift double what you can bench! if you cant deadlift double what you bench then that means your back and legs are too weak proportionally.

ya theharjmann is right. I'd be more concerned if my deadlift or squat was lower then my bench...

[sockpirate]

Just wondering if you guys have any advice for guys with long fucking arms, as i said im 6 foot two, all my other power lifts like deds, and squats are strong as hell and never takes me long to get over a plateau on them. But lately bench has been giving me shit.... I maxxed at a measley 300 tonight was hoping for 315 but it was not happening with how gruesome 300 was... Any ideas? strength building work outs for chest? Currently i do 8-10 reps at 225 for first set , 8 reps at 245, 6 reps @ 265 and then finish with 4 reps @ 275. Bench has always been my weak point on chest. Just need some help brothers!!!

[Jon_Blaze]

Try changing up your chest routine for a little bit. If you're hitting flat and no incline switch that and see if that helps. What's your whole chest routine look like?

[prowrestler]

learn to arch

all benchers over 1000 pounds have been over 6 foot. ( possibly not relevent anymore but at a time)

learn to bench properly too. look for dave tates bench cure video

[InkdMuscle]

try switching to DB presses. I shit you not, Rage told me to lay off BB benching and stick to DB for a while. I did that got up to incline DB press the 130's and a couple of weeks ago i hit 350 on bench. I went from 295 to 350 it took me about 6 months or so. but thats about 10lbs a month i went up in bench. just by doing a simple switch to DB pressing.

[Dr.Platypus]

good advice on the DB presses. I'm 6'2 as well and my shoulders and tris always take over my chest on BB bench, DBs really get my chest.

[fenix237]

also consider doing a bench specific program- there are several out there. i've done them with great results. in the past when i've plateaued on bench, what helped me was to reduce the volume

[sockpirate]

my routine usually looks like this

-flat bench-4 sets
8-10@225
8@245
6@265
4@275
-incline dumbbells-5 sets
8-10@80
8@95
8@95
8@95
till failure on 80s
-cable cross overs
4 sets start @ 40 end at 70 or 80
-flat bench
aiming for 3 sets @ 225 im usually extremely spent by now

any advice or changes to this is welcome. my goal is 315 asap i know its a viable goal because i put up 300 relatively easy but 305 humbled me pretty good ha ha



ps. (i cant train higher than 95 on dumbbells cause some fucking disrespectful fucks broke the 100s by dropping them sometimes even from standing positions its a college activity center so nothing higher than 100)

[sockpirate]

I cant tell if i am at a plateau or just making slow gains , bench for me is usually slow, took me a good month to get 275 to 4 reps. and my form is relatively good .

[fenix237]

my routine usually looks like this

-flat bench-4 sets
8-10@225
8@245
6@265
4@275
-incline dumbbells-5 sets
8-10@80
8@95
8@95
8@95
till failure on 80s
-cable cross overs
4 sets start @ 40 end at 70 or 80
-flat bench
aiming for 3 sets @ 225 im usually extremely spent by now

any advice or changes to this is welcome. my goal is 315 asap i know its a viable goal because i put up 300 relatively easy but 305 humbled me pretty good ha ha

ps. (i cant train higher than 95 on dumbbells cause some fucking disrespectful fucks broke the 100s by dropping them sometimes even from standing positions its a college activity center so nothing higher than 100)

how often do you workout chest? i believe IF your goal is to increase your bench, then this is not an optimal routine- drop the cable crossovers and the last 3 sets of bench press. work some singles, doubles, and triples in there. like i said, lower volume & higher intensity (1RM)

weighted dips are great movement for building a big bench too. the last thing i will say is to learn ggod form- good form for BB'ing is different than good form for PL'ing- you might need a narrower grip and keep those elbows in- this allows you to use more tri's and back (safer too!)

[sockpirate]

I do chest once a week. On Tuesdays. From what I'm reading on this thread, seems like i may drop the last 3 sets of 225 , get rid of cables (for now) throw in some heavy weighted dips. And try for some heavier sets probably strictly 3 heavy sets? for bench that is.

[radderz]

hello, i need to increase my bench. I can squat 200 and deadlift 200 easy but i can only bench 100. Could you suggest what i could do to get past my bench plateau?

[C.Coronato]

Whats your chest workout right now?

[ghost]

Whats your chest workout right now?

chest workout, diet, weight, and supporting muscle workouts... all play a HUGE factor in to your actual bench... as well as your form.

[radderz]

my chest workout is:

incline 4 sets
flat 3 sets
decline 3 sets

i can do 120 on incline and only 90 on decline

[fenix237]

radderz- it sounds like you need an overall program to get going on- your only 16, so you have LOTS of time and opportunity to build an impressive physique. i would suggest you spend some time snooping around the Forvm and choose a specific routine and go for it. any solid program will have your bench increasing along with all the others. follow the program as outlined, eat right, lift your lil' balls off, and your golden

your diet will be as important as anytihng- make sure your eating a balanced diet, take a good vitamin pack, and don't worry about taking "XYZ supplement of the week"- lots of eggs, chicken, beef, fish, milk, oats, rice, pots, fruits, veggies,...eat up bro and watch yourself grow!

[radderz]

yea this makes me think of what hugh cassidy once said: "eat through sticking points!"
I will start 5x5 and then after that i will try out westside

[ghost]

yea this makes me think of what hugh cassidy once said: "eat through sticking points!"
I will start 5x5 and then after that i will try out westside

are you going for more Powerlifting or Bodybuilding? if bodybuilding, do not bother with westside..

[radderz]

i want to go for powerlifting because i believe that i am gifted genetically for the squat and deadlift, but i have one concern: will i gain mass even if i do powerlifting instead of bodybuilding?

[ghost]

i want to go for powerlifting because i believe that i am gifted genetically for the squat and deadlift, but i have one concern: will i gain mass even if i do powerlifting instead of bodybuilding?

yeah you will gain mass, because the amount of food you will be eating and the training you will be doing will blow you up....

[radderz]

ok good. So is the 5x5 a good program to make me used to heavier loads coming from a more bodybuilding kind of wokout?

[BionicMasterPiece]

i want to go for powerlifting because i believe that i am gifted genetically for the squat and deadlift, but i have one concern: will i gain mass even if i do powerlifting instead of bodybuilding?

are you joking about you being genetically gifted for the squat and deadlift?

[fenix237]

are you joking about you being genetically gifted for the squat and deadlift?

although you have to earn your gains whether your into bb'ing or pl'ing, i believe people can be "genetically" gifted to excel at powerlifting just like bb'ing. things like height, weight, cross diameter of muscle, muscle type, origins and insertions of muscles, assimilation of food, recuperative abilities etc...all play into what your potential is

do you think everyone has the same potential to be a powerlifter or bodybuilder?

[J Wong]

i want to go for powerlifting because i believe that i am gifted genetically for the squat and deadlift, but i have one concern: will i gain mass even if i do powerlifting instead of bodybuilding?

Yes, my best mass gains are on a PL program compared to a body part split.

As for increasing your bench...gain weight and get on a good program! I gained about 15 lbs along with following the conjugated method and my bench sky rocketed.

[BionicMasterPiece]

although you have to earn your gains whether your into bb'ing or pl'ing, i believe people can be "genetically" gifted to excel at powerlifting just like bb'ing. things like height, weight, cross diameter of muscle, muscle type, origins and insertions of muscles, assimilation of food, recuperative abilities etc...all play into what your potential is

do you think everyone has the same potential to be a powerlifter or bodybuilder?

Sorry but you mis-understood my sayings. Its alright though Ill stop my trips to this thread before it gets ugly.

Have a nice day playa.

[fenix237]

Sorry but you mis-understood my sayings. Its alright though Ill stop my trips to this thread before it gets ugly.

Have a nice day playa.

it's all good bro- but why would things possibly get ugly???

[IRBS]

are you joking about you being genetically gifted for the squat and deadlift?


Sorry but you mis-understood my sayings. Its alright though Ill stop my trips to this thread before it gets ugly.

Have a nice day playa.

Biomechanically some people can have an advantage in the Squat, Bench, or Deadlift (this comes from your genetic makeup, ie, what Mom and Dad give you...). It's simple physics. Some people will just always be better at certain lifts and weaker at others. Nothing to get your panties in a wad over. Happens all the time in Powerlifting. Go to a meet, it's pretty easy to spot.

[Cstlfx]

Biomechanically some people can have an advantage in the Squat, Bench, or Deadlift (this comes from your genetic makeup, ie, what Mom and Dad give you...). It's simple physics. Some people will just always be better at certain lifts and weaker at others. Nothing to get your panties in a wad over. Happens all the time in Powerlifting. Go to a meet, it's pretty easy to spot.

Definitely. I have short, thick legs, that make it better for squatting. But my torso and arms (compared to my lower body) are long, thus making me work harder for my bench.

To also answer Radderz

Yes, gaining mass is quite the possibility. If you eat a lot and try not to stay a certain weight, you can gain some really good quality mass.

[zHazzarD]

Dudes, I have hit a brick wall on my bench. It does not go past 215lb. I can barely get my one rep max on 225. This is what my bench day normally looks like:

Bench: warm up 135 1x10, 165 1x10, 185 1x8, 205 1x6

Incline Bench: 135 1x10, 155 1x10, 185 1x6, 195 1x5

Incline Pec dec fly's: 37lb DB 3x10

DB Pullovers: 45lb DB 3x10

I'm into powerlifting and any suggestions, comments would greatly be appreciated.

Dude, I don't know how you not getting 225 yet, it must be all in your head, cuz 185 for 8 then 205 for 6... you should easily be putting up 225, just talk your self into it instead of out of it.

[Universal Rep]

Biomechanically some people can have an advantage in the Squat, Bench, or Deadlift (this comes from your genetic makeup, ie, what Mom and Dad give you...). It's simple physics. Some people will just always be better at certain lifts and weaker at others. N

x2

[Preservation]

trying squeezen your chest as you push the weight up and do drop sets it may help you bust out...a bit

[Eric210]

JM Press work very well, i hit a plateau and worked on my JM press getting it to 225lbs for 4 reps increase my bench about 20lbs. Also board presses are useful, switching your routine from a 3x1 at 90% to a heavy 4x10 works good (just an example of switching your routine up)

[msktyshha]

Dude, I don't know how you not getting 225 yet, it must be all in your head, cuz 185 for 8 then 205 for 6... you should easily be putting up 225, just talk your self into it instead of out of it.

The dude, cut the 165X10 set and rest for atleast 2 minutes between sets and maybe even 3 mins between ur second last and last set and pretty sure u'll put up 225......good luck

[tao]

my bench was stuck at 250 for awhile, i got westside barbells "book of metods" and now i am stuck at 300. not too bad for less than a years worth of work.
if oyu are looking for strength,look into westside barbells book of methods and any of there videos. alot of the time when you get a sticking point,your triceps are holding you back. or it could be something else. if oyu want your bench up,you will train bench prob. twice a week along with auxillary exercises to bring up things like triceps.i cannot reccomend their porducts enough. not to mention while lifting like they reccomend and eating bigger,i gained good solid size gains to go with the strength.
like ronnie coleman says "everybody want to get big,but nobody want to lift heavy ass weight"
follow that advice and size and sterngth will be yours. you can do it because i did.

[Dingo]

just stumbled upon using a size 75 stability ball (i know Im going to possibly get reamed for using, let alone mentioning a stability ball on the forum) and positioning it so that it is in the middle of your back, this way your shoulders receive some support but not as much as the ball being directly under them. This positioning forces you to use less weight than a normal dumbell chest press and you have to focus more on the contraction. EG: normal dumbell chest press is 110-120 for me, with the ball positioned in above described position i have to use 70-80lbs db's. It forces you to rely on the power generated by the pecs, and shoulders instead of using the leverage of a bench to be able to push more weight. I use this technique after of course i have already used flat and incline barbell benchpresses.

[Devil]

Any other body parts lacking? Get a good training partner and fight through heavier weight with support. You'll be surprised how fast you blow past 225.

[christian99]

so recently i have noticed that im pretty much plateauing in a lot of stuff.
my bench is stuck at 225. however my usual chest day is not with the bar but with dumbells. today my chest looked like this

flat bench db
60x8
70x8
70x8
75x6
flat db flys
35x10
40x8 40x8
incline bench on smiths(deep)
135 x10
185x7 for the other 2 sets

cable crossovers an what not then hit up dips an vbar

ive been stuck on 75 lb to 85 lb dumbells on flat for prolly 2 or 3 months now an my bench wont go above 225 since about that time also. my shoulders are also stuck so is my back. i try to get real deep on reps an always shoot for 6-8 so maybe its a possible diet issue? i eat a ton of carbs a day proteins an whatnot. im on a cell tech hardcore. but its not seeming to help. bros if u guys can think of anything to get me out of this rut let me know

[almosteasy]

i would not recommend using a ball for ANY lifts. i have seen it pop along with the ulna and radius on both arms. not a safe method.

[Zieben]

Diet shouldn't be a problem - especially if you're eating plenty of carbs & protein.

Something you may want to consider is "Muscle Confusion"

Animal's definition of "Muscle Confusion": An approach to combat stagnation and encourage progress. By varying your routine (exercises, reps, sets) and other factors, you prevent your body from adapting to any set stimuli.



So, if you're constantly holding down a set routine of 6-8 reps, you may want to try to hit the 10-12 range, even if it means using a lesser weight with more sets. This way you'll be pushing your muscles further than they normally are used to functioning - even with less weight.


I hope this helps.

[blaine]

first off nice chest routine
change it around a bit and try and have fun. for 3 weeks on your chest days do barbell or smith machine then for 2 weeks do dumbbells. you have to really push yourself by trying to use a weight that you can do only 4-6 of. having a spotter that can force a rep will get you off that plateau. personally incorporating HRT into your routines will add mass and help those numbers. for instance lets say ur max db is 90. after getting warm grab the 65's and do 8 reps, rest then get your hands on the 75's and do maybe 6 reps, give yourself a little bit of time then hit up 85's for hopefully 4-6 reps, if your feeling it go for it again. then after a short rest grab the 65's and bust out 8 reps normally then after your 8th rep do 4 more reps but with a slow controlled 5 seconds on the negative portion.

as per your plateau on shoulders and back apply that same concept for your main lifts like military press and dumbbell or barbell rows.

just make sure you are hitting those legs and having deadlifts as your main back lift should set you up for success

good luck brochacho

[christian99]

alright thanks bros ill keep these tips in mind. i do need to change things up. ill let you guys know in a week how it goes

[suicidegripme]

so recently i have noticed that im pretty much plateauing in a lot of stuff.
my bench is stuck at 225. however my usual chest day is not with the bar but with dumbells. today my chest looked like this

flat bench db
60x8
70x8
70x8
75x6
flat db flys
35x10
40x8 40x8
incline bench on smiths(deep)
135 x10
185x7 for the other 2 sets

cable crossovers an what not then hit up dips an vbar

ive been stuck on 75 lb to 85 lb dumbells on flat for prolly 2 or 3 months now an my bench wont go above 225 since about that time also. my shoulders are also stuck so is my back. i try to get real deep on reps an always shoot for 6-8 so maybe its a possible diet issue? i eat a ton of carbs a day proteins an whatnot. im on a cell tech hardcore. but its not seeming to help. bros if u guys can think of anything to get me out of this rut let me know

Possibly a diet problem.


If it isnt, dont take offense to what Im saying. You say say your bench is stuck at 225, but you dont bench usually. How are you supposed to get better at a lift if you dont do it frequently. Sure strengthening the supporting muscles helps, but you need to work on the movement itself.

Whens the last time you took a deload week? How long have you been doing a split like this? Is your goal strength or size? Whens the last time you changed up your routine? What are your other lifts like?

[christian99]

no offence taken bro. ive been doin this for probably 2 or 3 months. i never used to do dumbells it was always bar. however its not only my bench that i cant get up ya know my dbs havent been increasing either. my overall goal is strength the size will come later.

[suicidegripme]

no offence taken bro. ive been doin this for probably 2 or 3 months. i never used to do dumbells it was always bar. however its not only my bench that i cant get up ya know my dbs havent been increasing either. my overall goal is strength the size will come later.

You might want to try a completly different style routine (one that emphasizes compounds). If I were you I might run a program like the one listed below. You hit all the muscles you need to with decent volume and with a good diet you should see good strength gains as well as size gains.


FRANKIE NY'S MASS PROGRAM

Several of you have asked me for a good mass building program, so here it is. I've used this routine with many natural bodybuilders as well as professional football players looking to add some bulk in the offseason.

How many days a week? I've seen the best results with natural bodybuilders in a bulking phase on 3 days a week, training each exercise once a week. I know almost every program in the magazines you guys read will say 4 days a week, training each muscle twice a week, but my experience with hundreds of guys is that guys that train 4 days a week never make the same gains as the ones that train 3 days a week. If you train a muscle hard enough, you just can't recover in less than 6-7 days. Just because the soreness is gone doesn't mean that the muscle is recovered. 4 and 5 day splits are fine for cutting phases but not for bulking.

How to split things up? Push, pull, and legs seems to be the best split for most guys. Working shoulders with legs doesn't yield good growth in the shoulders because they end up overtrained. On push shoulders get hammered, on pull shoulders get hammered, and even working legs shoulders get hit.

Sets and reps? Like I said before, if you want to gain mass you need to stay around 5-6 reps. 4x6 or 5x5 are both good combinations. In my experience the guys that make better gains on 8-12 reps are advanced bodybuilders or are on drugs. I don't care if you feel a pump or a burn or whatever. That has nothing to do with size or strength, only momentarily pumping blood into a muscle.

Increasing your weights? You need to add weights to the bar every workout if you can. Going up in 2 ½ or 5 pound increments is great. You won't be able to add more weight each week, but that needs to be your mentality. Don't think about anything else but adding weight.

How long to stay on a routine? My experience is that around 8-12 weeks is best. Some guys say that after 6-8 weeks they've hit a plateau and need to change their routine. That's hogwash. Most of the time they've hit a plateau because they're not training hard enough or because they've added in more exercises than what's in my program and hinder their recovery.

DAY 1 – PULL

Deadlifts or Power Cleans
Barbell Rows, Dumbbell Rows, or Wide Grip Chins
Barbell Curls, Close Grip Underhand Chins, or Hammer Curls

DAY 2 – PUSH

Incline or Flat Barbell or Dumbbell Bench Press
Barbell or Dumbbell Shoulder Presses
Tricep Dips or Close Grip Bench Press

DAY 3 – LEGS

Front or Back Squats
Barbell or Dumbbell Stiff Leg Deadlifts
Calf Raises (3x12) - only if a seriously lagging bodypart
Weighted Crunches or Weighted Hanging Leg Raises (3x12)

[christian99]

alright bro ill probably start doing that next week or so. ill just kill my muscles everytime i do that. if u guys got any ideas on some supps i wouldnt mind

[suicidegripme]

alright bro ill probably start doing that next week or so. ill just kill my muscles everytime i do that. if u guys got any ideas on some supps i wouldnt mind

AnimalPak - Foundation
Some Nitric Oxide/Creatine - Pre-Workout
Some Protein Powder - Post Workout or as a MRP
Beef Aminos or Uni-Liver - cheap aminos

Remember, diet is key. All the supps in the world wont make up for a poor diet. Try to eat ATLEAST 5 times a day, that is a minimum. Eggs, beef, chicken, peanut butter, milk, all that good stuff. Go to school, work, wherever with a lunchbox or a shaker or a plan on what you are going to eat. Proper daily/weekly planning is the key for a good diet. I used to wing it, but constantly missed meals. Winging it does not have a place when trying to pack on mass.

[christian99]

yeah i know what u mean bro thanks

[zHazzarD]

unless you are looking to be a power lifter, who cares? strength will come, do 185 for 10 or 12 reps and I'm sure you'll get it

[suicidegripme]

yeah i know what u mean bro thanks

No problem man. Hitting a plateau, second guessing yourself, Ive been there before too. It sucks. Just gotta keep pushin, let me know how Frankie NY's works for you. If you like the program, check out Max-OT, a very similiar training style but with more excercises. Luckily youre a member here, this by far the best forum/site Ive ever been on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHOCJmlqa5k
Go to 2 minutes 50 seconds. A little extra inspiration for ya!

[PORTERHOUSE]

change everything around man. Do what you do last first and so on. Switch around rep ranges. If your always lifting in the 6-8 rep range, your short changing yourself. Work one one rep max in something (best to be compounds, like bp), work in higher rep ranges for other things. Do it for a few weeks then switch back to your normal routine. Then after awhile, switch things around again. Then switch things around again, ya dig?

simplicity.

[d1sc1ple]

If you are just interested in strength then you need to train heavy and hard, I suggest switching to 3 weeks of 5X5 training, and not like oh I did 5 reps and but feel like I could do eight, I mean 5 heavy ass reps. You will need a training partner/spotter. Take a full 3 minutes rest after you lifts. After you do Bench work on your other chest lifts in a range of 6-8. Only do compound movements, no flyes or crossovers. I would hit Incline DB's and finish with Weighted Dips, or switch them if your not strong in dips. Do the same type of workouts for your other bodyparts. After 3-5 weeks decrease to 3X3 rep range on Bench or primary movement then follow up with 6-8 on your other lifts. Do this for 3 weeks or so take a week off or at least a few extra days and have a Max day, it should improve your bench. Remember to constantly increase your weights every workout if possible thats the key. I did this to break my plateau of 315, it skyrocketed to 340!

[d1sc1ple]

Maxing out correctly is a tricky business, how much rest how many warmups etc.

-First lets talk about warmups, I like to do alot of warm-ups do to shoulder issues. I don't do alot of reps though. I also do Rotator Cuff exercises before any pressing movements.

example: 135X5, 185X5, 225 X 3-5, 275X3, 315X1 then usually do my expected MAX, if I get it easy or fail I take 2-3 minutes rest, up to 5 minutes, then do another lift.

-Body Position is important, I wear a Weight Belt up a little higher on my back for support.

When I lay on my back on the bench the bar should be even with your forehead or higher! this is why you need a spotter to unload and rack the bar!

I pull my legs towards my head, to where I can barely put my heels on the ground, you want your butt, shoulders, back, and head pressed against the bench with a small-medium arch in your back.

My hands are wider than shoulder width but preference is still up to you, I think that wider is stronger. I pull down on the bar with my lats for a 5-10 seconds before I lift to activate them for my lift, I then squeeze my shoulder blades together and ask for a lift off. Control the weight on the way down, and yes you need to touch your chest! When I press the bar up I am trying to push my body through the bench, Feet through the floor etc. I am also trying to pull the bar apart with my hand, they are not moving! just imagine gripping really tight and pulling out on the way up.

These tips really helped me and came from My friend who was the 7th strongest 200 pound lifter at nationals in college, not a small feet!

Good Luck and always Max with a trusted spotter or two!

[d1sc1ple]

just stumbled upon using a size 75 stability ball (i know Im going to possibly get reamed for using, let alone mentioning a stability ball on the forum) and positioning it so that it is in the middle of your back, this way your shoulders receive some support but not as much as the ball being directly under them. This positioning forces you to use less weight than a normal dumbell chest press and you have to focus more on the contraction. EG: normal dumbell chest press is 110-120 for me, with the ball positioned in above described position i have to use 70-80lbs db's. It forces you to rely on the power generated by the pecs, and shoulders instead of using the leverage of a bench to be able to push more weight. I use this technique after of course i have already used flat and incline barbell benchpresses.

OH MAN! I am gonna be nice here, Balls are for strengthening your core. But you know what does it better? Heavy Lifts! DO some heavy presses and squats and you will get a good core. They will not get you much stronger. There is no need to embarass yourself, and if you lift properly aka heavy as possible, you will injure something on a stability ball. Save that for ab and cardio sessions.

btw that was tough being nice :)

[Dingo]

OH MAN! I am gonna be nice here, Balls are for strengthening your core. But you know what does it better? Heavy Lifts! DO some heavy presses and squats and you will get a good core. They will not get you much stronger. There is no need to embarass yourself, and if you lift properly aka heavy as possible, you will injure something on a stability ball. Save that for ab and cardio sessions.

btw that was tough being nice :)

its been the only way ive been able to eliminate leverage from the press equation. When lying on a bench the shoulders are braced, and so if you notice when you are really trying to get that one last rep you shift your weight up onto your shoulders and end up taking the power out of the pec and into the shoulders and tri's. when using cables for standing cable presses, or bent over cross overs you still use your body's position to brace and stabilize against gravity. with the ball in the middle of my back, and not behind my shoulders there is no bracing, and there is no way to go as heavy as a braced exercise. I have found it forces the pec to do most of the work of the actual press while keeping the shoulder muscles doing what they are meant to do, stabilizing the shoulders.
its cool i know its not for everyone.
btw lifting properly does not equate to "heavy as possible"
I lift heavy as possible quite often (my max deadlift is 465) and I can guarantee you that it does not build the "core" as well as you think. I got my ass handed to me by a 110lb female trainer with a stability and core workout in less than 30mins, but this is getting off the topic... so lets hash this out here:
http://forum.animalpak.com/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=5

[Mauricio]

just my two cents here bro. most brothers will advice you to change up and give your muscles the confusion factor of new exercises or lenghtier/shorter sets but here's something a lot of people fail to acknowledge: your nervous system's pretty much ovetrained as well. give yourself a week off to let your body catch up, during this free period grab a book or two about strength training and plan out your next 8-10 weeks of workouts. i know a few old school bodybuilders would agree with me on this though, doing 4 different exercises for any body part on the same session sounds like overkill and overtraining because there's no way you can reach max intensity doing that many reps, but i'll let you hit the books for now and see what you come up with. train hard and best wishes to you.

[PORTERHOUSE]

just my two cents here bro. most brothers will advice you to change up and give your muscles the confusion factor of new exercises or lenghtier/shorter sets but here's something a lot of people fail to acknowledge: your nervous system's pretty much ovetrained as well. give yourself a week off to let your body catch up, during this free period grab a book or two about strength training and plan out your next 8-10 weeks of workouts. i know a few old school bodybuilders would agree with me on this though, doing 4 different exercises for any body part on the same session sounds like overkill and overtraining because there's no way you can reach max intensity doing that many reps, but i'll let you hit the books for now and see what you come up with. train hard and best wishes to you.

Time off is definitely a good idea. A week or two off and you will come back more fresh than you can believe. However, that doesn't mean you shouldn't switch stuff up on top of it. Take a week off and come back with a new routine.

As far as planning your next 8-10 weeks out, well thats ok but if I were you, I wouldn't go crazy with over planning. There's a fine line of having a smart approach and completely over planning everything. Have a basic mindset of what you want to do and then go for it, theres no need to have a complete blueprint of every single move you are going to make over the next 8 - 10 weeks. While you may feel like by over planing you wont miss anything, you will actually greatly limit yourself if you work solely off your blueprint.

Just know what you want to do, and do it. Learn to train by feel and intuition, it ain't rocket science.

[d1sc1ple]

its been the only way ive been able to eliminate leverage from the press equation. When lying on a bench the shoulders are braced, and so if you notice when you are really trying to get that one last rep you shift your weight up onto your shoulders and end up taking the power out of the pec and into the shoulders and tri's. when using cables for standing cable presses, or bent over cross overs you still use your body's position to brace and stabilize against gravity. with the ball in the middle of my back, and not behind my shoulders there is no bracing, and there is no way to go as heavy as a braced exercise. I have found it forces the pec to do most of the work of the actual press while keeping the shoulder muscles doing what they are meant to do, stabilizing the shoulders.
its cool i know its not for everyone.
btw lifting properly does not equate to "heavy as possible"
I lift heavy as possible quite often (my max deadlift is 465) and I can guarantee you that it does not build the "core" as well as you think. I got my ass handed to me by a 110lb female trainer with a stability and core workout in less than 30mins, but this is getting off the topic... so lets hash this out here:
http://forum.animalpak.com/newthread.php?do=newthread&f=5

will agree with you that some people react differently to other types of training but I will still stand by not using one to work out, esp for a guy who can't bench over 225.

Going as heavy as possible means lifting correctly, when you use the best form possible you won't get those problems. Also I didn't mean to offend man, thats my bad! I can guarantee I would get whooped from one of those workouts, but... I am not training to have the best balance possible or super great agility and stamina. When it comes down to it I train for a specific purpose. And in a fairly new to the game is concerned he needs tto do the tried and true. Old school has worked for centuries and when you see the guys puting up WR i can promise they won't say hey grab a ball. again didn't mean to get you all fired up man but I have seen injuries come from people using those balls, he won't have a trainer like you did so that can get extra risky.

[Mauricio]

nah bro, i didn't mean do something different every workout for the next 10 weeks :) more like knowing what exercises you're going to perform and which ones you're going to be switching nothing extraordinary. it's better to step foot in a gym with a battleplan than just going in there and doing whatever.

[PORTERHOUSE]

nah bro, i didn't mean do something different every workout for the next 10 weeks :) more like knowing what exercises you're going to perform and which ones you're going to be switching nothing extraordinary. it's better to step foot in a gym with a battleplan than just going in there and doing whatever.

yea, a plan can definitely be a good thing. All I'm saying is that too many people try to turn this shit into into rocket science. There's no need to have every single exercise and rep scheme down on paper. If you know how to train and listen to you body, have a vast knowledge of different movements, and keep several different methods and plans of attack in your back pocket, there's no need to ever have to bring ink and paper into this.