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redskin 344
12-28-08, 12:45 pm
I usually have a hard time getting to sleep at night due to my add/adhd which cause my restless thoughts making it hard for me to relax. I dont have zma yet but Im hoping on making some on my own. I know its just magnesium zinc and vitamin B6 right? I've been taking a centrum multivitamin at night which contains 11mg of zinc and only 100 mg magnesium along with 100% of my DV of B6. I think its been easier for me to sleep and relax in bed at night but I need much more of its effect. I also have a banana which contains an additional 40 mg of magnesium but it isnt nearly enough. Im thinking about getting some magnesium caps from vitamin shoppe or something.

Ive heard some place that having calcium with magnesium/zinc sort of hinders the effect of zinc at night or something. I also know that while magnesium is used for calming the nerves and muscles, calcium is used for exciting nerves and contracting muscle by shortening the Hzone. But at some other sources it said that calcium helps to sleep. There is calcium in milk and there is also some calcium in the multivitamin I take every night.
So should I or should I not take calcium at night with the mag/zinc?

simpleguy
12-28-08, 1:28 pm
I'm no expert but I think the form in which those minerals are found in zma also has something to do with it... you can't just take a multi that has those amounts and say that you're taking zma

for instance take a look at UN's ZMA Pro:


Serving Size 3 Capsules
Servings Per Container 30
Amount Per Serving % DV
Vitamin B6 (As Pyridoxine HCL) 10.5mg 525%
Zinc (As L-Monomethionine And Aspartate) 30mg 200%
Magnesium (As Aspartate) 450mg 113%

redskin 344
12-28-08, 1:43 pm
I also said that I would take an extra magnesium cap at night which contains 250 mg of magnesium, along with the centrum multivitamin and a banana is 360 mg which is close to the daily allowance of 400 mg. I dont see the point to taking 200% of your daily requirement of zinc... your body is only gonna use half of that which is 15 mg.

Im just wondering if the calcium that I will be consuming with it will benefit or interfere witht he mag/zinc.

simpleguy
12-28-08, 1:50 pm
I dont see the point to taking 200% of your daily requirement of zinc... your body is only gonna use half of that which is 15 mg.


but you are aware that we need even 20 times more then the RDA suggests for some vitamins like B6 for instance

do you think your body knows that 15mg is the RDA for zinc and will use that, no more no less?

Fury317
12-28-08, 2:54 pm
Hey man, I usually eat eggs and take zma. Most bottles say dont take with calcium for the reasons you alrady stated, but I figure that it cant have that much effect either way and the results are still there. So I say go ahead and drink milk if you want, or eat eggs or whatever. This has been talked about a couple times, and G Diesel has said he still has calcium with his last meal and takes his ZMA, and still gets good results. Dont fret over little things like that bro.

Also I would suggest picking up a bottle of ZMA if you have the funds. Its pretty dirt cheap and if you drop that Centrum (which I hate to say is crap- the body cant break down those capsules- but thats a different story) youd have enough to buy a bottle of Universal ZMA- boom got your perfect doses and you dont have to make your own ZMA

Good luck bro, hope everything works out.

Flash419
12-28-08, 3:08 pm
I also said that I would take an extra magnesium cap at night which contains 250 mg of magnesium, along with the centrum multivitamin and a banana is 360 mg which is close to the daily allowance of 400 mg. I dont see the point to taking 200% of your daily requirement of zinc... your body is only gonna use half of that which is 15 mg.

Im just wondering if the calcium that I will be consuming with it will benefit or interfere witht he mag/zinc.


That recommended daily allowance was never meant to be used like it is. The RDA is was is required to keep a body alive.. the fact that you got out of bed.. and walked over to your computer, already means you require more then the 100% RDA.. The RDA for protein is 50 grams.. so.. drink a double scoop of protein.. and avoid all other meats, shakes, and pills. And let me know if you make any muscle gains.. LOL

You need to take ZMA as it comes.. adding up what you get from other things or pills wont work. And yes.. calcium fights with magnezium in the body.. so avoid milk and calcium supps. ZMA is actually one of the cheaper supps out there... look online.. get a months supply for less then $10.

redskin 344
12-28-08, 3:26 pm
That recommended daily allowance was never meant to be used like it is. The RDA is was is required to keep a body alive.. the fact that you got out of bed.. and walked over to your computer, already means you require more then the 100% RDA.. The RDA for protein is 50 grams.. so.. drink a double scoop of protein.. and avoid all other meats, shakes, and pills. And let me know if you make any muscle gains.. LOL

You need to take ZMA as it comes.. adding up what you get from other things or pills wont work. And yes.. calcium fights with magnezium in the body.. so avoid milk and calcium supps. ZMA is actually one of the cheaper supps out there... look online.. get a months supply for less then $10.

lol o my bad I thought the rda showed how much the body will actually use. So if you take 30 mg of zinc when your body will only use 15 mg..ur a idiot

but whatever, thanks for the valuable info.

but at night when I take ZMA to knock me out so I can get good sleep, what if I need some casein protein for slowly digesting through the night. I usually use milk as my source.

redskin 344
12-28-08, 3:38 pm
I could also take Animal Pak with a magnesium capsul. Animal Pak has a shitload of vitamin B6 and zinc.


WHo knew these three minerals could have such an incredible anabolic effect on the human body. The past years i was focusing on high protein carbs and fats and thought 'vitamins and minerals' were for pussies..damn was I wrong.

simpleguy
12-28-08, 3:44 pm
I could also take Animal Pak with a magnesium capsul. Animal Pak has a shitload of vitamin B6 and zinc.


WHo knew these three minerals could have such an incredible anabolic effect on the human body. The past years i was focusing on high protein carbs and fats and thought 'vitamins and minerals' were for pussies..damn was I wrong.

bro, these minerals don't have 'such an incredible anabolic effect'... you might see a slight change in your test levels (though I doubt it), but it will make you sleep better

redskin 344
12-28-08, 3:52 pm
bro, these minerals don't have 'such an incredible anabolic effect'... you might see a slight change in your test levels (though I doubt it), but it will make you sleep better

So thats the whole point of ZMA, to make you sleep better?

Whatever I dont need to increase my hormones anyways, Im almost 18 just like you.

krazyassmexican
12-28-08, 3:57 pm
dont complicate your life and get some over the counter melatonin

simpleguy
12-28-08, 4:03 pm
dont complicate your life and get some over the counter melatonin

yeah that will work good as well... for me both helped me sleep better (deeper and longer)

norrim1
12-28-08, 4:07 pm
I usually have a hard time getting to sleep at night due to my add/adhd which cause my restless thoughts making it hard for me to relax.

Are you being treated for your ADHD?

redskin 344
12-28-08, 4:19 pm
dont complicate your life and get some over the counter melatonin

tried it...worked a bit for a littlw while but not on the long run. Melatonin is a hormone and it does promote sleep dude, it only tells ur mind that its dark so its time for bed. What I need is something that can help my nerves to relax so I can put my restless thoughts aside and go to sleep. Melatonin does not do that, magnesium DOES do that (im very sure).

redskin 344
12-28-08, 4:21 pm
Are you being treated for your ADHD?

I will be soon. Im hoping to get some medication.

krazyassmexican
12-28-08, 4:27 pm
tried it...worked a bit for a littlw while but not on the long run. Melatonin is a hormone and it does promote sleep dude, it only tells ur mind that its dark so its time for bed. What I need is something that can help my nerves to relax so I can put my restless thoughts aside and go to sleep. Melatonin does not do that, magnesium DOES do that (im very sure).

what dose were you using?
use something like 5mg of melatonin and 3mg of gaba if you dont sleep with that then you have a problem

norrim1
12-28-08, 4:30 pm
I will be soon. Im hoping to get some medication.

Yeah, that could be a big reason why your not sleeping as well as you should. Talk it over with your doctor, I'm sure there's something that he/she can prescribe to you that will help you get a handle on your condition. I would do that first and see how it goes, and you can ask about some of these other supplements.

Pizzalamp
12-28-08, 4:31 pm
good luck...

redskin 344
12-28-08, 4:39 pm
Yeah, that could be a big reason why your not sleeping as well as you should. Talk it over with your doctor, I'm sure there's something that he/she can prescribe to you that will help you get a handle on your condition. I would do that first and see how it goes, and you can ask about some of these other supplements.

Sounds good. Thanks.


what dose were you using?
use something like 5mg of melatonin and 3mg of gaba if you dont sleep with that then you have a problem

I was only taking 3-6 mg melatonin every night. It worked at first I think I mean I could feel my mind getting tired but the restless thoughts were still there. I dont understand how melatonin is supposed to help adhd people sleep and I dont get why its recomended. It cant relax the nerves and it cant put the restless thoughts at ease so therefor it cant do shit. All its good for is regulating jet lag by telling your body when to sleep.

krazyassmexican
12-28-08, 5:16 pm
Sounds good. Thanks.



I was only taking 3-6 mg melatonin every night. It worked at first I think I mean I could feel my mind getting tired but the restless thoughts were still there. I dont understand how melatonin is supposed to help adhd people sleep and I dont get why its recomended. It cant relax the nerves and it cant put the restless thoughts at ease so therefor it cant do shit. All its good for is regulating jet lag by telling your body when to sleep.

i am pretty sure if you take melatonin and go out or have the tv on it wont do shit to be able to sleep you have to create the atmosphere (spelling)

melatonin helps gettin quality sleep it has been proven by cientific research

redskin 344
12-28-08, 5:39 pm
i am pretty sure if you take melatonin and go out or have the tv on it wont do shit to be able to sleep you have to create the atmosphere (spelling)

melatonin helps gettin quality sleep it has been proven by cientific research

well according to me its bullshit. Ive tried not watching any tv 2-3 hours before bed and having a warm cup of milk before bed along with 6mg of melatonin and it didnt do any good.
If it does help a non-adhd person get good quality sleep, it doesnt help an adhd person because it doesnt stop the restless thoughts or relax the nerves. I can be tired as fuck from taking melatonin but my mind will still be constantly thinking which is a huge obstacle if I want any sleep.

I have faith that ZMA will knock me out because magnesium is supposed to relax the nerves and muscles and is involved in the transmission of nerves. Still the medication is my #1 priority right now. Just like 'Animal Pak' it will be my foundational supp and I will add fish oil and ZMA around it for a better effect..

krazyassmexican
12-28-08, 5:43 pm
why dont you go to the doctor and get prescripted medicine?
if you got that type of problems you will need it

redskin 344
12-28-08, 5:55 pm
why dont you go to the doctor and get prescripted medicine?
if you got that type of problems you will need it

I will soon.

redskin 344
12-29-08, 1:13 pm
just wondering but do you also need good sleep for strength gains as well?

krazyassmexican
12-29-08, 1:14 pm
just wondering but do you also need good sleep for strength gains as well?

most likely hell yeah

redskin 344
12-29-08, 1:22 pm
that sucks

i really need to get some zma then

still I dont really understand how I made gains over the summer though. I got buff and many people noticed. I can't trully recall if I was able to sleep well or not. Maybe its my youth i dont know.

Fury317
12-30-08, 12:12 pm
Melatonin does not induce sleep. It is converted to seratonin and about 1 in every 10 people will be aided in sleep by this. Leaving 9 out of 10 with nothing but there thumb up their ass. ZMA is much better for relaxation and the initial falling asleep, and it also helps with REM sleep.

stick to the ZMA redskin

also I would say stay away from perscription sleep aids, they wont fix the problem, they will just mask it. Ive been on Ambien and Lunesta and yeah they fucking work when you take them, but then you get used to having to take them, and then when you dont take then youre back to the insomnia. Just get your body into a rhythm. 30 min before bed, take your ZMA, dim the lights, turn off the tv and computer, and read a book, YOU WILL FALL ASLEEP.

Also if stress is bothering you, EARLY in the afternoon, write down everything in your head in a notebook. It has been proven to get those thoughts out of your brain so you can relax at night. But make sure its at like noon, not 10pm haha.

Elite
12-30-08, 12:35 pm
Yeah, that could be a big reason why your not sleeping as well as you should. Talk it over with your doctor, I'm sure there's something that he/she can prescribe to you that will help you get a handle on your condition. I would do that first and see how it goes, and you can ask about some of these other supplements.

^^^
Take the above advice.

Also a few points....
Making up for ZMA in the form of a banana here, a multi there and a magnesium capsule will not be the same in any way. The Zinc & Magnesium in ZMA is of a certain type and dosage to do the job. Personally i've found taking ZMA doesnt make me the slighteset bit sleepy or relaxed, but does help when i eventually do sleep in promoting a better quality of sleep and enhanced feeling of wellbeing in the morning, aka i dont feel my usual zombie like state and feel refreshed. Melatonin on the other hand does relax me and within an hour im ready to hit the sack, tho i dont feel as refreshed in the morning.

Also the ZMA/Calcium issue. I say take your ZMA 45-60mins before bed, then take your Casein right before you get in bed, that way the ZMA has had good time to make its way into your system without encountering any calcium.

Elite
12-30-08, 12:37 pm
also I would say stay away from perscription sleep aids, they wont fix the problem, they will just mask it. Ive been on Ambien and Lunesta and yeah they fucking work when you take them, but then you get used to having to take them, and then when you dont take then youre back to the insomnia. Just get your body into a rhythm. 30 min before bed, take your ZMA, dim the lights, turn off the tv and computer, and read a book, YOU WILL FALL ASLEEP.

Also if stress is bothering you, EARLY in the afternoon, write down everything in your head in a notebook. It has been proven to get those thoughts out of your brain so you can relax at night. But make sure its at like noon, not 10pm haha.

Although conflicting with seeing a DR, this is also good advice.

redskin 344
12-30-08, 2:58 pm
Melatonin does not induce sleep. It is converted to seratonin and about 1 in every 10 people will be aided in sleep by this. Leaving 9 out of 10 with nothing but there thumb up their ass. ZMA is much better for relaxation and the initial falling asleep, and it also helps with REM sleep.

stick to the ZMA redskin

also I would say stay away from perscription sleep aids, they wont fix the problem, they will just mask it. Ive been on Ambien and Lunesta and yeah they fucking work when you take them, but then you get used to having to take them, and then when you dont take then youre back to the insomnia. Just get your body into a rhythm. 30 min before bed, take your ZMA, dim the lights, turn off the tv and computer, and read a book, YOU WILL FALL ASLEEP.

Also if stress is bothering you, EARLY in the afternoon, write down everything in your head in a notebook. It has been proven to get those thoughts out of your brain so you can relax at night. But make sure its at like noon, not 10pm haha.


^^^
Take the above advice.

Also a few points....
Making up for ZMA in the form of a banana here, a multi there and a magnesium capsule will not be the same in any way. The Zinc & Magnesium in ZMA is of a certain type and dosage to do the job. Personally i've found taking ZMA doesnt make me the slighteset bit sleepy or relaxed, but does help when i eventually do sleep in promoting a better quality of sleep and enhanced feeling of wellbeing in the morning, aka i dont feel my usual zombie like state and feel refreshed. Melatonin on the other hand does relax me and within an hour im ready to hit the sack, tho i dont feel as refreshed in the morning.

Also the ZMA/Calcium issue. I say take your ZMA 45-60mins before bed, then take your Casein right before you get in bed, that way the ZMA has had good time to make its way into your system without encountering any calcium.


Great advice guys. thanks.

THe thing is I already got some megnesium tablets yesterday. I forgot all about looking for any ZMA. Its the megnesium in the ZMA that has the relaxing effect right?