Chest Day

[beastfromny23]

Is it counterproductive to do flat, incline, and decline bench in the same workout?

I feel that by the time I get to decline i'm not able to go as hard to hit lower chest.

any suggestions would be helpful

[Freakshow]

Is it counterproductive to do flat, incline, and decline bench in the same workout?

I feel that by the time I get to decline i'm not able to go as hard to hit lower chest.

any suggestions would be helpful

I used to try and do all 3 in one workout, but now I just hit two of them max. I always do incline bench, but I will either do flat or decline with it, and alternate weeks.

I dont know that it is counterproductive to do all 3 in one workout, but if you cant go as hard when you get to your third exercise, I would split them up.

[G Diesel]

In my opinion the decline is a worthwhile exercise but not essential. I'd say I hit something on a decline apparatus every 20th workout or so. Training heavy on inclines and the flatty should be more than sufficient to induce maximal pec growth. Peace, G

[Mr.Totality]

I used to try and do all 3 in one workout, but now I just hit two of them max. I always do incline bench, but I will either do flat or decline with it, and alternate weeks.

I dont know that it is counterproductive to do all 3 in one workout, but if you cant go as hard when you get to your third exercise, I would split them up.

agree. Hit two of them (usually flat and incline). Worry about declineonce every 3 weeks or so.

[NickSP]

IMO all 3 presses is overkill, I usually stick to 2 presses and a fly for my workout. Also, I'm an oddball from most people here, I don't emphasize inclines as much as a lot of the guys here seem to

[Big Wides]

instead of declines every workout, try dips i feel they are better than the decline since it hits the tris and shoulders as well, which are a big part of a big bench

[Big Jawn]

Is it counterproductive to do flat, incline, and decline bench in the same workout?

I feel that by the time I get to decline i'm not able to go as hard to hit lower chest.

any suggestions would be helpful


I used to always have the mindset, that if I did something like that I'd be hitting that bodypart from every angle and thats the best thing i could do for myself. But the truth is, you don't need to do everything and you can't do everything, limit it two at the most IMO.

[JUGGERNAUT]

A lot of brothers on the same page... Yeah, all the focus should be on Flats and there is no doubt you can build a solid chest with just that one movement. You can always switch it up but never delete the Flat Bench from any one session. My personal fav is Flat followed by Dumbbell Inclines and some Flat Flys. Not having done Declines frequently; even to this day I can do more weight there then Flat if I do once in blue moon.

[LuvsThePain]

I used to hit all 3 presses in one day. My third was usually incline and it always sucked because of the first two presses. After switching up the order every now and then and doing a flat followed by either incline or decline, I've noticed good improvement. Flys and cross overs follow after that.

[TheNaturalG]

You guys gotta realize that Flat is also one of the worst exercises for your rottor cuffs. If you are going to be in it for the long haul and your goal is bodybuilding not powerlifting you really don't need the exercise.

[jDubs]

i've always found variety to be the most important thing. switch which exercise is first and you are probably lifting the heaviest on, switch up your rep/set schemes etc. i spend less time worrying about which exercises i am picking and whether i am hitting my chest from every angle there is, and more time focusing on making gains and improving every week.

[ransom.holland]

It depends,... you have neither stated that it was all heavy lifts are not. (I don't do declines, because my lower chest is already ahead of upper chest). But my workout for chest could involve, if I wanted, all three.
FOR EXAMPLE:
BENCH PRESS or DUMBBELL PRESS= 5reps X 3sets 85% max
INCLINE PRESS or DUMBBELL INCLINE PRESS= 12reps X 3sets 80% max
DECLINE PRESS / CABLE CROSSOVERS or FLYES= (SS) 40reps X 3sets 40% max

This allows me to hit all my chest at different angles, with different techniques. By the end of the day I have fully loaded my chest, plus next workout will be rotated starting with DECLINE and so forth. By involving such a technique in your workouts you can develop a highly porpotionate chest.

[deeder]

You guys gotta realize that Flat is also one of the worst exercises for your rottor cuffs. If you are going to be in it for the long haul and your goal is bodybuilding not powerlifting you really don't need the exercise.

Rotator cuff.. And why is flat bench so hard on the rotators compared to incline or decline?

[NickSP]

I think a lot of people don't realize that you CAN'T isolate the "upper" or "lower" chest. The pec major is ONE muscle, it works as a whole. Even if you could put some slight emphasis on one head or the other, it would be such a small degree that it really wouldn't make a difference. It's not like if you naturally have a shitty upper chest, always doing inclines will change the way your chest develops, doesn't work like that. GENETICS. Just lift hard and be sure to switch it up here and there

[hscrugger]

my chest day looks like this:

Incline Barbell Presses – 5x12-15
Flat Bench Flyes – 3x15
Cable Crossovers – 3x15
Dumbbell Pullovers – 2x12-15

the presses are my main mass-building movement. the flat flyes tone the mass given by the incline press, and if i go a little lower than even with the bench on the negative portion of the rep, i get a killer stretch on the interior part of the pecs and feel it more there, which brings out the separation between the two pecs. the crossovers dial in detail, and the pullovers are just there to push blood into the muscles because i needed a finishing move that didn't need as much motion as a press or flye, but just enough to force more pump into the pecs.

brennan

[Big Jawn]

I can see where you guys are coming from, but alot of you are needlessly bashing the flat barbell bench press for causing the shoulder problems your having. The fact of the matter is its likely your fault your getting injured, I'll go over why and then you tell me if its the flat bench's fault.

First we'll start with the scapula (shoulder blades), are you retracting them when you bench? If your not sure what I mean, raise your hands to your sides and squeeze your upper middle back together. When you dig your shoulders into the bench and squeeze your scapula together, this stabilizes them. If you do NOT do this it means that the shoulder structure is completely responsible for the support of the bar load. This is just fine as long as you are not working up to heavy loads that will compromise the integrity of the smaller muscles , capsules and yes this includes your beloved rotator cuff.

So when the scapula are retracted, they are fully supported by the bench. So, when the load of the bar pushes down, the shoulders can drive into the bench and push back.

That’s basically what you can do to take the stress off your shoulders, and whats it called? Jawn’s Secrets to Benching Volume 1? Nah its called proper form…so before you bitch about shoulder problems from the bench press, think about this…are you using proper form? Are you lowering more weight then you can push back up? Are you doing exercises for the muscles that stabilize the weight, mainly the rotator cuffs (teres minor, the infraspinatus, the supraspinatus and the subscapularis) , upper/middle back and the lats? Are you warming up and taking enough time to recover?

Remember boys your bodies a temple, neglect certain aspects and it’ll leave you fucked up on the ground crying for mommy. The bench press is more then just a chest exercise and its more then just lowering the bar to your chest and pushing back up. Train smart.

[Big Jawn]

my chest day looks like this:

Incline Barbell Presses – 5x12-15
Flat Bench Flyes – 3x15
Cable Crossovers – 3x15
Dumbbell Pullovers – 2x12-15

the presses are my main mass-building movement. the flat flyes tone the mass given by the incline press, and if i go a little lower than even with the bench on the negative portion of the rep, i get a killer stretch on the interior part of the pecs and feel it more there, which brings out the separation between the two pecs. the crossovers dial in detail, and the pullovers are just there to push blood into the muscles because i needed a finishing move that didn't need as much motion as a press or flye, but just enough to force more pump into the pecs.

brennan

Brennan you can not tone a muscle nor can you bring out separation or dial in detail (which essentially are the same), that has to do with genetics and body fat.

Think of it this way...your body is an iron sculpture, but you can not add details to the sculpture (reshape the muscles)...cause fuck its iron!, you can add onto the sculpture (chance the size, hypertrophy) and you can create the illusion of adding details ( by bringing up to par other muscles in the area or losing bodyfat).

[hscrugger]

difference of opinion, perhaps based in semantics. the muscles feel different after different exercises, and they recover differently, as well.

brennan

[hscrugger]

and i don't do flat bench presses because i separated my shoulders in rugby, and it's quite painful to do them correctly. and since i get good results from inclines, it doesn't bother me that i can't do them.

brennan

[GADO]

In my opinion the decline is a worthwhile exercise but not essential. I'd say I hit something on a decline apparatus every 20th workout or so. Training heavy on inclines and the flatty should be more than sufficient to induce maximal pec growth. Peace, G

Agreed. Incline and Flat are staples in my routine. Decline hardly ever gets included, unless I decide to throw in dips at the end. I actually put more emphasis on incline now, after years of indulging my love of heavy flat benching without equal work on my upper pecs.

[BigAnt]

If you have no shoulder pain/problems flat bench and do it HEAVY! Inclines, pick 2 movements (either dumb bell, barbell, smith machine or fly) and try finishing with a cable movement. Maybe every 3rd or 4th workout try inclines first than move to the flat bench. No really lower chest muscle, if you train with the basic movements, and build your strenght up, the entire chest (pecs) will grow!

[Joe Pas]

i like weighted dips more for decline but i dont usually do them on chest day i do them usually with tri's ...but if i do switch it up and throw them in on chest i do them 1st as warm up ...i do decline barbell or i use the decline hammer strength every now and then to get a different feel ...but neither hit me like dips do ...

[TheNaturalG]

I can see where you guys are coming from, but alot of you are needlessly bashing the flat barbell bench press for causing the shoulder problems your having. The fact of the matter is its likely your fault your getting injured, I'll go over why and then you tell me if its the flat bench's fault.

First we'll start with the scapula (shoulder blades), are you retracting them when you bench? If your not sure what I mean, raise your hands to your sides and squeeze your upper middle back together. When you dig your shoulders into the bench and squeeze your scapula together, this stabilizes them. If you do NOT do this it means that the shoulder structure is completely responsible for the support of the bar load. This is just fine as long as you are not working up to heavy loads that will compromise the integrity of the smaller muscles , capsules and yes this includes your beloved rotator cuff.

So when the scapula are retracted, they are fully supported by the bench. So, when the load of the bar pushes down, the shoulders can drive into the bench and push back.

That’s basically what you can do to take the stress off your shoulders, and whats it called? Jawn’s Secrets to Benching Volume 1? Nah its called proper form…so before you bitch about shoulder problems from the bench press, think about this…are you using proper form? Are you lowering more weight then you can push back up? Are you doing exercises for the muscles that stabilize the weight, mainly the rotator cuffs (teres minor, the infraspinatus, the supraspinatus and the subscapularis) , upper/middle back and the lats? Are you warming up and taking enough time to recover?

Remember boys your bodies a temple, neglect certain aspects and it’ll leave you fucked up on the ground crying for mommy. The bench press is more then just a chest exercise and its more then just lowering the bar to your chest and pushing back up. Train smart.

You make a good point that I mostly agree with. I don't personally have shoulder problems, but so many people have pec tear and rotator cuff injury stories I have heard that it just is not worth it to me. If you love the bench press and it works great for you without shoulder problems by all means use the exercise. I just wanted to point out that flat bench is not needed for a good chest and it can be bad for your rotator cuffs. This being the new forum it is there are alot of threads about flat bench already and I just wanted to put what I knew out there.

[Wolf Man CHG]

I never do all three at once....I agree with working 2 max per session......and dips are perfect for getting the deep seperation from the breast bone across the chest muscle...I always get the best workout if I tilt my body slightly forward when doing dips.

[Reacher34]

I'll have to agree with these guys that its a good idea to use dips instead of flat bench. I don't know how much truth is in this, but a powerlifter at my gym told me that doing heavy declines are real bad for your shoulders. Maybe he meant after already doing heavy flats, which we know are bad for shoulders (but we still love em!).

[cable]

honestly i never do a decline press, i think it is a wasted movement. with a decline press your utilizing way to many muscles (this is obviously why most ppl can lift more on a decline), i think that by doing this your not putting enough direct stress on the pec and you just end up using precious energy that could be better spent somewhere else.

[alkalineman]

i'll do dips over decline any day, as I respond better to that movement. decline may be fun every once in a while though.

[NickSP]

I think a lot of people don't realize that you CAN'T isolate the "upper" or "lower" chest. The pec major is ONE muscle, it works as a whole. Even if you could put some slight emphasis on one head or the other, it would be such a small degree that it really wouldn't make a difference. It's not like if you naturally have a shitty upper chest, always doing inclines will change the way your chest develops, doesn't work like that. GENETICS. Just lift hard and be sure to switch it up here and there

..

[invictus]

after doing flatbench then incline; i knew that if i still had a strong decline, i probably didn't work the first two hard enough

i do think, for me, it's overkill to do all three

flats and incline give me the shape, size and strength i need while the dips keep my strength functional

silly if you can bench 300+ but can't dip 50 reps

[G Diesel]

I think a lot of people don't realize that you CAN'T isolate the "upper" or "lower" chest. The pec major is ONE muscle, it works as a whole. Even if you could put some slight emphasis on one head or the other, it would be such a small degree that it really wouldn't make a difference. It's not like if you naturally have a shitty upper chest, always doing inclines will change the way your chest develops, doesn't work like that. GENETICS. Just lift hard and be sure to switch it up here and there

I agree that it is one muscle, however, from a practical, real world perspective, it is often easy to identify the individual who focusses on incline movements because of the shelf-like upper pec protrusion that they sport. That said, I still believe that flat bench (when executed properly) serves a vital purpose in any serious bodybuilder's routine. Peace, G

[Big Al]

I'm with G,the decline is not a great movement.I haven't been on the decline bench for months.I might do it every few months.I am going to try that close grip that naturalG was talking about in another thread.
MY chest workout is like
one week
flat bench 2 warm ups 3-4 working sets
Incline BB 1 warm up 3 working
Incline hammer 3-4 working
might do some DB fly's 2-3 sets

The next week it might be;
Incline DB 2 warm up 3-4 working
Incline BB 1 warm up 3 working
Flat BB 3-4 working.
Finish with one set 25 rep or failure flat bench.
Love that burn.

[Punisher]

Im wity Big Al on this Decline never really did much for me besides causinga ton of blood to rush to my head. It is an uncomfortable movement and imo the same results for chest growth can be achieved by focusing on incline and flat alone. i never understood those guys who focused on decline as their main chest movement as they usually are the ones with no chest.

[Idlethoughts]

switch the routine. if you start with chest one day, start with incline the next, incline the next then start with decline the following chest day and so on and so forth. Mix it up with barbell's, dumbbell's, bodyweight, etc.

[NickSP]

I'm a HUGE oddball out on this one. I haven't done much incline and I have a very "full" look (as opposed to a flat upper coming down to a large lower). I've been doing a lot of decline and I've seen phenominal gains. I view it the other way around, the more incline you go the more shoulders get involved. I'm no expert on what happens with the RC during each one, but I be sure to throw in some rotator cuff work every shoulder day

[king1]

I generally dont do any decline movement. Whether dumbells or barbells I feel like my shoulder are in trouble when doing any decline movement, since my shoulders are my best body part, and have never had an injury i stay away. If i wanna change it up ill throw in a double drop set on the decline hammer press which feels fine on my shoulders. But flat and incline barbell presses have and will always be the center of my chest day. Besides who can go all out on several sets on 3 different pressing movements for the chest?

[LuvsThePain]

I've had good results with decline. Maybe I'm just different than everyone else. I usually hit decline every other week and I've recieved quality gains because of it. I used to not do decline, but the moment I rotated it in every now and then I gained size and strength very quickly. This has helped me get a very balanced and strong chest. Like I said, maybe I'm just the oddball out of the bunch.

[Supe527]

I agree with G. Incline and Flat or good enough for pec growth. I don't usually do decline b/c it is just a weird lift for me. I do dips instead. Dips are very close to the same thing as decline. Decline I usually need a lift off and since I work out alone most of the time I just do dips. Plus I can get better work on my tricpes (for me) with dips.

[Dingo06]

decline???? whats this??
j/k
for some reason it feels awkward because its such a small movement. i only flat for warmup sets as well as finishing sets....
at the beginnning and end of every WO 2x20 @ 60% of my 5x5 weight

[In Flames]

My current Chest workout.

3 x 4-6 Flat BB Bench
3 x 6-12 Incline DB Bench
3 x 12-15 Dips
1 x 30-50 Incline Fly's

[npeezy]

i dont do any declines...my chest workout is as follows...

incline barbell press - 4 sets 12,9,6,10
flat barbell press - 4 sets 12,9,6,10
incline dumbbell press - 3 sets 12, 10, 8
cable crossovers - 3 sets 12, 10, 15