The Cardio Thread

[live2lift]

I came across this article the other day...
http://webmusclefitness.com/2-cardio-mistakes-youre-still-making/

It basically comes down to what Tiny said earlier in this thread...sometimes we tend to overthink things and this article touches on that. In my opinion, some of the blame is put on the magazines and supplement companies (excluding UN of course cuz their shit is basic, solid and proven) because they overhype some bullshit as being the next big thing and we end up getting overwhelmed. Sometimes I think we need to take a step back and rethink things and go back to simple, proven shit that works. IMO the basics have always worked the best. This is not only with cardio but with workouts in general.
This is just my 2 cents and you can agree or disagree...The big hype amongst BBs is that any intensity above low intensity in reference to cardio is going to burn muscle. I call BS on this because first of all, I don't think that you can burn muscle. Now breaking down muscle is a different story...this I believe can be done. But I believe that muscle breakdown from cardio comes more from excessive cardio than from the intensity of the cardio...therefore I think that too much cardio, even if it is low intensity will breakdown muscle. Case in point would be a marathon runner...now I know that you have all heard the comparisons of a marathon runner versus a sprinter but this is a different take on it. The cardio that a marathon runner does should be considered low intensity because of the length of their cardio sessions(if it was high intensity they couldn't keep it up for the length of time they do) and the fact that they are so conditioned that what would be moderate intensity for a normal person is low intensity for them. A marathon runner lacks the muscle size because of how excessive their cardio is. Now if running or any other moderate to moderate/high intensity cardio burned muscle then you would never have a muscular football player or sprinter. I believe that all cardio, if excessive, whether through intensity or duration will breakdown muscle. The difference with the football player, or sprinter versus the marathon runner to me would be the fact that sprinters and football players lift weights to build muscle whereas marathon runners probably don't, or if they do it is not geared towards size but probably more towards endurance. So basically what I am saying in a nutshell is that all cardio breaks down muscle if excessive and we as BBs have to do something to offset that, which is the lifting that we do. Now don't get me wrong I am not anti-low intensity, I am just for whatever intensity or duration is going to burn the most amount of calories. I say again, take a step back brothas, get back to basics and burn some damn calories...cuz that is pretty much what it comes down to. Calories in versus calories out. Regardless of where the calories are coming from just burn em. Again, this is my 2 cents...you can take it or leave it.

Peace

[Mackk]

My Cardio question is pretty simple, I hear all the time that it's best to do Cardio right after lifting, but since I'm trying to pack on muscle and have a large insulin spike at this time, wouldn't it be pointless to do cardio then? I do 15-20 minutes before lifting and have been able to stay lean and pack on muscle pretty well, am I making the best possible choice if I'm determined to keep building muscle and keep bf% low?

[Aggression]

My Cardio question is pretty simple, I hear all the time that it's best to do Cardio right after lifting, but since I'm trying to pack on muscle and have a large insulin spike at this time, wouldn't it be pointless to do cardio then? I do 15-20 minutes before lifting and have been able to stay lean and pack on muscle pretty well, am I making the best possible choice if I'm determined to keep building muscle and keep bf% low?

Cardio is best served either on an empty stomach, or right after lifting. Hit the weights, hop on a bike, then down some Torrent and you'll be set.

[Tiny]

My Cardio question is pretty simple, I hear all the time that it's best to do Cardio right after lifting, but since I'm trying to pack on muscle and have a large insulin spike at this time, wouldn't it be pointless to do cardio then? I do 15-20 minutes before lifting and have been able to stay lean and pack on muscle pretty well, am I making the best possible choice if I'm determined to keep building muscle and keep bf% low?

I don't know where you "hear all the time" that cardio is best performed right after lifting. You're correct that it is seriously counterproductive to do cardio right after lifting. Of course everytime I am in the gym it is crowded lately but guys like Machine and I aren't out here in the world bumping into each other as if we are so many in number. So yeah, maybe a lot of people are saying cardio should be done right after lifting . . . Now, if a person is desperately and primarily trying to drop bodyfat (lard), then, sure, no problem with a bit of cardio after lifting - but for us mass monsters? No way Jose (not even if I were dialing in for a show, and believe it or not, my frequently chub ass has dialed in with abs so deeply etched that you could grasp each one of the eight with your fingers).

[T82]

So seeing as how most of this thread is mostly about treadmills I'd like to ask about using a stationary bike as a fat burner.


What I do is, after I'm finished training I've started hitting the stationary bike for 22 minutes right after I train. I do 10 minutes of steady pace around 77-80 rpm, never below, and then 2 minutes high intensity at about 100-105 rpm, then 8 minutes of steady pace same speed as I mentioned above, and then another 2 minutes of high intensity. Rumor has it that it does help burn fat, but I wanted to ask you guys what you think, will this help burn fat or am I just wasting my time.

[tmclssns]

The first 30 minutes of a cardio session you mainly burn sugar (and other things). After that initial period, you have to train in non-aerobic mode 60% max HR to work on the "fat".

That's why it's best to start your weight lifting session (after a slight warm up) and do your cardio after the weight lifting.

HIIT is the best cardio workout to your disposal (doesn't matter what type, bike, treadmill, cross trainer, etc.). But in order to start HIIT training, you have to be in decent condition. So the first few months it's best to start cardio at a slow pace (4 mph) inclined for 20-30 minutes. After a few weeks, increase your duration to 40 minutes (every time you do weight training, on off days I still do some cardio but it's not really required).

After six months or so, I switched to HIIT training. Usually I'm running (but switch back to rowing from time to time). My cardio workout usually lasts 30 minutes. 6 minutes warming up, 20 minutes HIIT (switching speed every minute) and then I run the last 4 minutes at a slow pace again (4 mph) + cooling down period.

[JUGGERNAUT]

The first 30 minutes of a cardio session you mainly burn sugar (and other things). After that initial period, you have to train in non-aerobic mode 60% max HR to work on the "fat".

That's why it's best to start your weight lifting session (after a slight warm up) and do your cardio after the weight lifting.

HIIT is the best cardio workout to your disposal (doesn't matter what type, bike, treadmill, cross trainer, etc.). But in order to start HIIT training, you have to be in decent condition. So the first few months it's best to start cardio at a slow pace (4 mph) inclined for 20-30 minutes. After a few weeks, increase your duration to 40 minutes (every time you do weight training, on off days I still do some cardio but it's not really required).

After six months or so, I switched to HIIT training. Usually I'm running (but switch back to rowing from time to time). My cardio workout usually lasts 30 minutes. 6 minutes warming up, 20 minutes HIIT (switching speed every minute) and then I run the last 4 minutes at a slow pace again (4 mph) + cooling down period.

This is what they preach in all personal training courses, it's FAR from ALL accurate and not real world with the pros/semi pros/advanced at all.

[simpleguy]

This is what they preach in all personal training courses, it's FAR from ALL accurate and not real world with the pros/semi pros/advanced at all.

agreed, there aren't many rules set in stone

[Tiny]

agreed, there aren't many rules set in stone

Phew! Man, I'm glad to see confirmation that many here know better than to believe everything someone posts up. I read this post about the burning mostly sugar for the first 30 minutes, etc. . . . . and I posted a response which I then thought might have been too "hard" so I deleted it. One of the beautiful aspects of our Forvm here is that any member can directly ask any other member how the hell they were able to accomplish . . . "whatever". . . and get an honest, first-hand experienced answer right from the horse's mouth. And there are indeed several roads which can yield success - very little is written in stone - but that 30 minutes of burning sugar comment is pure bullshit. And all the younger bucks out there need to realize that the act of exercise in itself is catabolic - trying to gain muscle? Then you want to get in, do sufficient damage and get the hell out so you can resume the requisite feeding and nurturing which engenders efficient rebuild/repair of tissue. You do not want to spend an additional period of time doing your cardio; that is a wholly separate endeavor, different goal, requiring a different lead up and totally different nutritional approach.

[simpleguy]

Phew! Man, I'm glad to see confirmation that many here know better than to believe everything someone posts up. I read this post about the burning mostly sugar for the first 30 minutes, etc. . . . . and I posted a response which I then thought might have been too "hard" so I deleted it. One of the beautiful aspects of our Forvm here is that any member can directly ask any other member how the hell they were able to accomplish . . . "whatever". . . and get an honest, first-hand experienced answer right from the horse's mouth. And there are indeed several roads which can yield success - very little is written in stone - but that 30 minutes of burning sugar comment is pure bullshit. And all the younger bucks out there need to realize that the act of exercise in itself is catabolic - trying to gain muscle? Then you want to get in, do sufficient damage and get the hell out so you can resume the requisite feeding and nurturing which engenders efficient rebuild/repair of tissue. You do not want to spend an additional period of time doing your cardio; that is a wholly separate endeavor, different goal, requiring a different lead up and totally different nutritional approach.


it's funny cause I was gonna give out my 2 cents but then I changed my mind since everybody like has their own opinion... yeah that 30 min sugar burning is def BS in my opinion, sorry to the one who posted it, it's just my opinion


it's also funny that everyone sees high-intensity cardio as the ultimate muscle-waster which is true... but technically, isn't that the same with our workouts?... what if we actually think of a moderate to high-intensity session, and I mean a bpm of 150 at least
more like of a workout? I mean, carbs -in moderate amounts- and protein before, after, and maybe even get fancy with stuff like glutamine, creatine, bcaas (or maybe have torrent which has them all)
but then all those who support walking as a type of cardio will come and say - why have carbs and burn them during cardio? because all high-intensity activities provide a great metabolic boost (why do athletes who train hard for hours eat so much, sometimes even junk food and stay lean?), which will mean more cals expended while you sit on your couch
truth is, if we had to only choose one between weight-training and low-intensity cardio for fat-loss purposes, in the long hault the ones who did weight-training (high-intensity) would lose much more fat... I think there's also an article on this at universalnutrition.com, something called weight training for weight loss I think

sorry for the long post regarding HIT... that been said I'm not relying on it totally.... I was just trying to say 'let's be a bit more open-minded and see things from different perspectives'... also I've tried the keto and low-intensity cardio, tried many other things and I think it would be great to use various approaches... most of the times I actually do what Tiny preaches, hit some l-carnitine and go for a moderate intensity session, trying to actually feel doing something, but not really that I lose my breath

[JimmyZ]

I recently started doing cardio the minute I wake up in the am, which is at 4. I grab a shaker, do the two heaping tspns of EAA stack and hit the road. Right now I mainly walk at a fast pace but I will step it up before too long. I have learned that since I only w/o three days a week and get the whole body in during the week, my w/o's are about 2 hrs long unfortunately so cardio is a big no for me at that time. I figure the empty stomach thing is best, then throw some EAA's in for anti catabolic reasons and I'll be set. I think house turned me on to that but have known it for some time, just never wanted to wake up that damn early, lol.

Oh and is it possible to get an EAA stack in a bigger container? lol. Why is it so small? :)

[naturalguy]

Oh and is it possible to get an EAA stack in a bigger container? lol. Why is it so small? :)

BCAA and EAA stack will be available in larger containers soon

http://forum.animalpak.com/showthread.php?t=21440

[JimmyZ]

BCAA and EAA stack will be available in larger containers soon

http://forum.animalpak.com/showthread.php?t=21440

Awesome, as it sits I have three new containers of EAA stack on top of my fridge right now, lol.

[raunchy]

I'm 17 y/o and have been following I'd say a pretty clean bulk...

Diet:
Meal 1:3 whole eggs, slice of toast, animal pak
2:peanut butter sandwich, 20g protein bar
3:1.5 scoops of real gains, almost 2 cups of 2% milk, a SHITTON of pb
4:turkey sandwich or something light (maybe oatmeal, can o tuna)
5:another shake, same as above
6:something small maybe a pb sandwich again before bed
pump pre
pack of nitro pre and post
omega before bed

I train religiously 6 days a week, it's been going great in the gym. The thing is I've been noticing yeah I'm getting pretty big. At only 5'7 I'm about 155lb in the a.m. and nearly 160lb mid-day but jesus my ass is outrageous. It's fuckin' out there but still hard as a rock ha. I usually throw in some LIGHT cardio about every other day or 3 days and perform plenty of ab work but my body can't get rid of this. It's nothing serious but I wanted to find out if frequent cardio would get rid of my giant ass and growing stomach. Still very new and open to this sport.

[raunchy]

ttt

any help before i head off to bed?

do i need cardio to get rid of this or is this typical bulking stuff?

soo discouraging

[thatdude111]

If you want to lose more weight do more cardio and cut back on some calories.
With cardio it's always good to switch it up so one day do HIIT and other days just jog or walk fast on an incline, jump rope do whatever.

[SQUAT or DIE!]

if your bulking your gonna gain some fat, its a fact of life... i say you can do 20 min cardio 3x a week.. if its not working then up it a bit... a big ass isnt a bad thing, that happens when ya squat!!!!

[raunchy]

Yeah it's probably the squats...I go real heavy and deep. I have great legs for this sport, it's just the littlest things that worry me. I suppose my bulk is coming to an end, i will incorporate some more cardio and continue eating as much as iam now to see if I could get any bigger without getting too outrageous. It's probably to soon to stop now...fuck losing what i worked so hard to see.

[MVP]

Hi

Bodyfat is natural during a bulking cycle. If you're gaining "too much" bodyfat there are two things you can do.

1) Incorporate cardio
2) Cut back on the calories

When you're gaining fat it's due to an excess in calories and not burning them off. A calorie surplus is natural during a bulking cycle but to avoid a lot of fat you could do cardio to convert more of the calories your body is not using into energy.

[Big Wides]

Embrace the Squatter's Ass.....but if you want to do some cardio say 20 minutes PWO 4 times a week and I would watch the carb intake. You may have to play around with it but then again it might hurt your recovery and all that jazz. I would stick with your current diet if your gaining size and weight then whenever you decide to slim down, the fat will melt off revealing all that hard work you've done

[raunchy]

Thank you everyone, I will be maintaining the same diet but will be running pwo every other day to keep everything together. You guys are the shit, much appreciated.

[J.Damico]

Being 5'7 you have shorter legs...which means shorter muscles.. so the only way they can grow is WIDER... and it's going to be easier and more noticeable for you shorter guys to gain those beastly legs we all want. Embrace it.