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View Full Version : I am a small guy, seeking big advice



Josepe
11-09-10, 5:51 pm
Two years ago, I was 135lbs,5'8" at the age of 34, looking at joining a gym for the first time. I didn't even wear shorts or a short sleeve the first year.

Thanks to all the support on this forum, I am now 162lbs, 5'8". I proudly wear shorts and t-shirts, showing off my relatively nicely built calves and large chest (for my size).

But I need more help guys, or at least advice. I have put on some body fat. If I had to do it all over again, I would have done a clean bulk, but frankly I just wanted to gain weight.

Now I am getting the second piece of the puzzle put together- nutrition. I just can't decide if I should cut first (to 150lbs) or if I should bulk up to 10bs pass my goal weight (gw is 170 of lean muscle), and then cut down go my GW.

I am leaning toward bulk followed by cutting, mainly because it's winter, I want bigger arms, and I fuckin' hate not eating and lifting big.

I estimate my body fat to be nearly 20% however.

I am thinking of a clean bulk to get me from 162 to 180:

3083 calories, based on real gains, egg whites, oates, fish, steak and vegetables--and more real gains.


SORRY for the long post. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Maybe this is more of a training thread?

THanks.

ronnie
11-09-10, 6:34 pm
Two years ago, I was 135lbs,5'8" at the age of 34, looking at joining a gym for the first time. I didn't even wear shorts or a short sleeve the first year.

Thanks to all the support on this forum, I am now 162lbs, 5'8". I proudly wear shorts and t-shirts, showing off my relatively nicely built calves and large chest (for my size).

But I need more help guys, or at least advice. I have put on some body fat. If I had to do it all over again, I would have done a clean bulk, but frankly I just wanted to gain weight.

Now I am getting the second piece of the puzzle put together- nutrition. I just can't decide if I should cut first (to 150lbs) or if I should bulk up to 10bs pass my goal weight (gw is 170 of lean muscle), and then cut down go my GW.

I am leaning toward bulk followed by cutting, mainly because it's winter, I want bigger arms, and I fuckin' hate not eating and lifting big.

I estimate my body fat to be nearly 20% however.

I am thinking of a clean bulk to get me from 162 to 180:

3083 calories, based on real gains, egg whites, oates, fish, steak and vegetables--and more real gains.


SORRY for the long post. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Maybe this is more of a training thread?

THanks.

hey man, glad to hear about your success! as for the whole bulking thing, i am a fan of dirty bulking. i believe that a dirty bulk adds more muscle mass quicker then just doing a clean bulk, but that is up for debate. i have heard that the advantage of doing a cut is that your body is more responsive to gaining after the cut. (suggesting you will gain muscle faster immediatly after the cut for a limited duration of time then you would have during the same duration of a dirty bulk. its a slingshot effect.)

myself, i would continue with your current bulking idea up to 180 then slim down to 170. just keep in mind that gaining fat alone is not good enough. make sure your lifts are going up as well as the weight scale.

as for your calories and the food you eat, i would suggest getting more of that 3000 total from whole foods rather then real gains. eat your caloric/nutritional goal in whole food, then add anything past it with supplements.

i didnt see milk in there, if your not lactose intollerent, get on the milk brother. 4L/1gallon a day is 2,000 calories.

good luck too you!

Josepe
11-09-10, 6:40 pm
hey man, glad to hear about your success! as for the whole bulking thing, i am a fan of dirty bulking. i believe that a dirty bulk adds more muscle mass quicker then just doing a clean bulk, but that is up for debate. i have heard that the advantage of doing a cut is that your body is more responsive to gaining after the cut. (suggesting you will gain muscle faster immediatly after the cut for a limited duration of time then you would have during the same duration of a dirty bulk. its a slingshot effect.)

myself, i would continue with your current bulking idea up to 180 then slim down to 170. just keep in mind that gaining fat alone is not good enough. make sure your lifts are going up as well as the weight scale.

as for your calories and the food you eat, i would suggest getting more of that 3000 total from whole foods rather then real gains. eat your caloric/nutritional goal in whole food, then add anything past it with supplements.

i didnt see milk in there, if your not lactose intollerent, get on the milk brother. 4L/1gallon a day is 2,000 calories.

good luck too you!

Thank you Ronnie. I really appreciate the feedback. YOu settled it- bulk up (clean and whatever else it takes), but make sure my lifts keep moving up as well. More milk, less real gains, and whole foods totaling 3000 cals.

PORTERHOUSE
11-09-10, 7:09 pm
Personally, I think 20% is way too high.

The fatter you are, the longer you are going to have to cut - the more lean mass you will loose.

If you really want to make change, I would diet down to 10% or so, then bulk back up slowly. Doesn't have to be an obsessively "clean" bulk, but that doesn't mean you should be eating at burger king either. If you can hold your self in the 12-15% range, cutting will be a breeze and you can get back to gaining sooner.

That's just my two sense, obviously everyone has their own opinions.

Necromatrix
11-09-10, 9:35 pm
I have a slightly diffrent outlook. Partially because of something Machine said,(still waiting for that article Universal. :) ), partially because of my own decision/perspective. Short of being a bodybuilder preparing for a show, I see no point to "cut" at all. I have always been a small guy and have hell trying to put on mass of any kind. Thus, I want to spend as much time as possible busting ass in the gym and at the table.

My "theory"? Set your diet/ macros as you see fit. For example, I picked the suggested HRT diet, which bases macros from your lean body mass. Now, I will continue this diet for the duration of HRT, and beyond. I monitor my weight and bodyfat once a month. If body fat goes up, for some reason, I will either adjust carbs, or raise cardio. If my gains slack off I will raise carbs and protien. Fat will always be kept to a minimum. However, I do not hesitate to have a hamburger here or a pizza there. Monitor, moderate but always progress.

I am by no means a proffesional, just my 2 1/2 cents.

PORTERHOUSE
11-09-10, 10:08 pm
I have a slightly diffrent outlook. Partially because of something Machine said,(still waiting for that article Universal. :) ), partially because of my own decision/perspective. Short of being a bodybuilder preparing for a show, I see no point to "cut" at all. I have always been a small guy and have hell trying to put on mass of any kind. Thus, I want to spend as much time as possible busting ass in the gym and at the table.

My "theory"? Set your diet/ macros as you see fit. For example, I picked the suggested HRT diet, which bases macros from your lean body mass. Now, I will continue this diet for the duration of HRT, and beyond. I monitor my weight and bodyfat once a month. If body fat goes up, for some reason, I will either adjust carbs, or raise cardio. If my gains slack off I will raise carbs and protien. Fat will always be kept to a minimum. However, I do not hesitate to have a hamburger here or a pizza there. Monitor, moderate but always progress.

I am by no means a proffesional, just my 2 1/2 cents.

In a perfect world, that would definitely be the way to go. However, most people aren't going to be able to make the gains they want without gaining a bit of unwanted fat. While I agree that going through extreme bulk/cut cycles isn't necessary, I also don't think its necessary to completely eliminate the cutting phase. Shit, cutting is my favorite time of the year, the cheat meals are awesome and who doesn't love getting shredded?