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auburn_1984
03-30-12, 12:53 pm
Hi, I was wondering how to get the pump effect. I use to get it but lately not as much. I have tried everything from rest-pause to drop sets to forced negatives. I just cant seem to get the pump. What does everyone do to get that max pump effect?

Appollonian
03-30-12, 1:03 pm
Hi, I was wondering how to get the pump effect. I use to get it but lately not as much. I have tried everything from rest-pause to drop sets to forced negatives. I just cant seem to get the pump. What does everyone do to get that max pump effect?

First of all has anything changed in your diet or sleep patterns? How about blood circulation issues that you know of?

And it's about the muscles doing the work, not about the work being done.

It depends on what I'm training, so for

Chest - multiple sets with moderate to heavy weight with presses (incline and flat) 3 -4 sets each incline/flat then go to a fly movement and do as many reps, then rest pause, and then maybe drop it
Arms - start off with multiple sets using light weight, then do some intensity work (drop sets or 21 or whatever). Right now I'm doing two drop sets on barbel curls, then I'll do two sets of 21, then do some double or triple drop sets on preacher curls. I'll throw in some dbell curls to really hit it hard.

That's just me, but I'm thinking if something used to work for you and doesn't anymore, it's not something in the gym that's affecting you. I've known a few people to quite training if they didn't get a pump or keep the pump during the workout. I wouldn't go to that extreme, but if you never get a pump I'd do some digging.

C.Coronato
03-30-12, 1:22 pm
What is your training and eating looking like? Do you take any pre-workouts?

AJP1
03-30-12, 1:31 pm
Some people say the pump is worthless....

What's your thoughts?

Carrnage
03-30-12, 5:43 pm
Hi, I was wondering how to get the pump effect. I use to get it but lately not as much. I have tried everything from rest-pause to drop sets to forced negatives. I just cant seem to get the pump. What does everyone do to get that max pump effect?

1)Make sure your glycogen stores are filled

2)Make sure your not training through a catabolic phase (typically for most people, after 3 days of consecutive day intense training, your body will be more catabolic)

3)Your execution, your probably engaging your secondary muscles to the point your targeted muscle is hardly even getting stimulated (pm me for this one, lol all of you know how many times ive explained this!)

4)Agmatine pre workout baby! (citrulline works well too!)

5)Utilize the eccentric part of the movement. People are so egotistical nowa days they keep the movement in the top half of the exercise focusing on the concentric, bottom half (stretched position) is where its at for mTor / mgf / igf-1 / hgh / muscle actually getting broken down is at.

Carrnage
03-30-12, 5:47 pm
Some people say the pump is worthless....

What's your thoughts?

Well, getting a extreme pump is a good indication your engaging the targeted muscle to its potential, and nutrient delivery is somewhat enhanced. But as far as nutrient delivery goes, if your not going to failure, progressively overloading your connective tissues/cns, nutrient delivery would mean NOTHING. I hate it when you see guys go in the gym and say...."oh im just gonna get some blood in the muscle today". Yeah, more like "im just going to half ass this session today".

The pump is a tool, gota learn how to use the other tools for the pump to work!

Big Joe
03-30-12, 6:48 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drioQ137NhA

Nobody said it better than Arnold, haha that shit makes me laugh every time!

auburn_1984
03-30-12, 11:48 pm
Things havent changed that much. It has been awhile since I had the pumped up feeling. I havent been getting as much sleep. Mainly because I train late in the day after 7:30pm to avoid all the social fanatics that want to stand around and talk. My supplements consist of Animal Pak, Animal Nitro pre&post workout, Optimum Oats&whey for small meals when i am pressed for time and cant get a meal in. I also take in fish oil with some meals. I am not sure if it is because not enough sleep or not lifting heavy enough weights. I am the type that would rather lift a little lighter to avoid cheating myself and not working out the targeted muscle. I hate it when i see people trying to lift heavy in the gym and only do half reps or sling the weight up when doing curls and use all back muscles. I am sure we have all seen them in the gym. As for training I am doing this program that i found on bodybuilding.com http://www.bodybuilding.com/guides/male-20to39-muscle-building/training I am about to give Y3T a shot to up the intensity. I drink 1+ gallons of water a day also. I eat dining facility since i am stationed at Osan AB South Korea right now. Here is a example of a days meal.

Break Fast
Egg white scramble with onions and green peppers
4 Boiled eggs (Eat whites only)
1 serv oatmeal with equal
3 glasses of water

Snack
1 serv oats and whey protein

Lunch
Baked chicken
Rice (usually white because dining facility only makes white rice)
Raw broccoli (ranch on side to dip broccoli in)

Snack
1 serv oats and whey protein

dinner
Turkey
Rice (white)
Salad

Snack before bed

tilipia
broccoli with ranch

Meals are about every 2-3 hours

AJP1
03-31-12, 8:40 am
1)Make sure your glycogen stores are filled

2)Make sure your not training through a catabolic phase (typically for most people, after 3 days of consecutive day intense training, your body will be more catabolic)

3)Your execution, your probably engaging your secondary muscles to the point your targeted muscle is hardly even getting stimulated (pm me for this one, lol all of you know how many times ive explained this!)

4)Agmatine pre workout baby! (citrulline works well too!)

5)Utilize the eccentric part of the movement. People are so egotistical nowa days they keep the movement in the top half of the exercise focusing on the concentric, bottom half (stretched position) is where its at for mTor / mgf / igf-1 / hgh / muscle actually getting broken down is at.

I havent seen someone mention agmatine on this board lol...
Either way do you take your 4 caps a day? even on non-lifting days? How do you dose it?

pushin weight
03-31-12, 10:25 am
Hi, I was wondering how to get the pump effect. I use to get it but lately not as much. I have tried everything from rest-pause to drop sets to forced negatives. I just cant seem to get the pump. What does everyone do to get that max pump effect?

One word my friend......WATER.Some days i will consume 3 liters of water during my workout.I think people overlook a simple thing like water but it is crucial in terms of getting a pump.

auburn_1984
03-31-12, 10:54 am
I will up my water intake to 1.5-2 gallons a day and see how that goes. Do you think it is better to do lower weight more controled or heavier weight with not as good form?

AJP1
03-31-12, 1:14 pm
I will up my water intake to 1.5-2 gallons a day and see how that goes. Do you think it is better to do lower weight more controled or heavier weight with not as good form?

Lighter weight better form.

GUNS
03-31-12, 1:46 pm
How long has it been since you changed up your workout? Your body may have adapted. Also, I would add in a little bit more carbs if you can. Also try upping your reps making sure your in the 12 range. Keep movements slow. Dont worry too much about weight. Example say on bicep curls, curl up slow and hold the peak contraction for 1 second, then come down slowly and use a negative style.

And you said you didnt like seeing people cheat or use 1/2 reps. You should try it. They are great tools. I understand that the joe schmoe douche bag at the gym thinks its cool to do it on every rep. But what Im saying is use those tools in your last set when your close to failure. cheat those curls up and squeeze that peak, followed by a slow controlled negative. And for partials, do them at the end as well. Some half curls will help with that pump. You can do top haf partials, middle partials, or lower partials.

Hope this helps you out!

Carrnage
03-31-12, 3:14 pm
I will up my water intake to 1.5-2 gallons a day and see how that goes. Do you think it is better to do lower weight more controled or heavier weight with not as good form?

Heavier weight with un-controlled form will result in injuries, obesity(via meathead mindset hehe), poor muscle development, shit I wouldn't even expect any size gains training heavy with poor form.

Carrnage
03-31-12, 3:17 pm
How long has it been since you changed up your workout? Your body may have adapted. Also, I would add in a little bit more carbs if you can. Also try upping your reps making sure your in the 12 range. Keep movements slow. Dont worry too much about weight. Example say on bicep curls, curl up slow and hold the peak contraction for 1 second, then come down slowly and use a negative style.

And you said you didnt like seeing people cheat or use 1/2 reps. You should try it. They are great tools. I understand that the joe schmoe douche bag at the gym thinks its cool to do it on every rep. But what Im saying is use those tools in your last set when your close to failure. cheat those curls up and squeeze that peak, followed by a slow controlled negative. And for partials, do them at the end as well. Some half curls will help with that pump. You can do top haf partials, middle partials, or lower partials.

Hope this helps you out!

Solid post!

For some reason, I dunno if its just me, but if I utilize the concentric more by squeezing the muscle at the top of the movement, I absolutely lose my pump lol. I personally like to keep the muscle in the stretch position like IFBB Pro Jason Huh does. Wicked pumps and joint pain eliminated.

auburn_1984
04-01-12, 1:19 am
I like to also do half reps towards the end of a excercise. Except I do it on every lift not just the last one. I try to aim for a rep range of 8-12 currently with 3 working sets. I switch up my routine about every month or 2 to introduce muscle confusion. Some times i will go to a low rep range to build strentgh so i can apply that extra strength when i go back to higher reps. I have to adjust carbs in my diet because i gain weight way to fast. I will up my carb and water intake and see how it goes. I just baught a rice cooker and some brown rice since the dining facility only believes in white rice here. So i will have brown rice in my room and baked potatoes from chow hall for carb sources. The sweet potatoes are priced like they are made of gold here so that is out of the equation until i get back to the states.

GUNS
04-01-12, 7:25 am
I like to also do half reps towards the end of a excercise. Except I do it on every lift not just the last one. I try to aim for a rep range of 8-12 currently with 3 working sets. I switch up my routine about every month or 2 to introduce muscle confusion. Some times i will go to a low rep range to build strentgh so i can apply that extra strength when i go back to higher reps. I have to adjust carbs in my diet because i gain weight way to fast. I will up my carb and water intake and see how it goes. I just baught a rice cooker and some brown rice since the dining facility only believes in white rice here. So i will have brown rice in my room and baked potatoes from chow hall for carb sources. The sweet potatoes are priced like they are made of gold here so that is out of the equation until i get back to the states.I dont change my body part split, but I do change my exercises every single week for muscle confusion. I highly recommend it. Example is if I hit Flat bench, DB incline, floor presses one week, I will hit Incline bench, DB flat, Pec-dec and Speed bench the next!

And I do a powerbuilding routine, where every few weeks I will max out on my compound exercise like deads, bench, OH press, Squats, which takes about a 1/2 hour of my 1 hur in the gym. The 2nd half is nothing but cruising through a few more exercises for sets of 12's making sure I get plenty of blood flow. This keeps my strength up and has helped me keep my poundage up when I rep out!

Dont get caught up in the brown vs white rice thing. Eat white if you got it. There is no huge difference. Galley food aint that bad and has come along way. Plenty of good food to chose from and looks like you are doing good with it.

auburn_1984
04-01-12, 8:38 am
Just to make sure i am understanding what u are saying. You choose one muscle group to do low reps each week or do you pick a excercise per muscle group each week? I have heard of people picking a muscle group and doing powerbuilding with compound movements then finishing it off with isolation movements then next week choose another muscle group to powerbuild.

GUNS
04-01-12, 9:09 am
Here is my last back day.

Deads
155x8
265x8
331x6
375x4
419x4
463x1
485x1

DB Rows
100x12
120x12x2

Wide cable pulldowns
Stackx12-15x3

Straight bar seated rows low ss Straight arm Rope pulldowns
stackx12-20x3 ss 80x12x3

I chose only one compound movement, then go balls out making sure I get my pump!

auburn_1984
04-01-12, 9:59 am
So for say chest you would do heavy pyramiding up to 1-3 reps the the rest high reps for pump. Along with one excercise from each body part. I will have to give that a try and see how that works out for me.

GUNS
04-01-12, 10:43 am
No, that was an all back day. Just keep your warmups to a minimum. Keep them at something that gets the blood flowing. Sometimes its 12, sometimes its 8. But only do mimimum sets of the higher reps stuff. Then work yourself up to your max with a couple sets of 4 or 3 and then to your singles. Once your done maxing that specific exercise out, add in 3 or so exercises of 3-4 sets of 12 reps. If you cant get to 12 then drop sets, partials or cheats come in to play.

auburn_1984
04-01-12, 2:49 pm
I will give that a try. Starting today I have legs. So I will max out on legpress. Then go to leg ext and leg curls for 3-4X12

GUNS
04-01-12, 3:44 pm
Sounds good, hope it works out for you. I highly recommend doing some ATG squats to 15-20 x3 sets after curls and extensions. Youll thank me later!

Carrnage
04-01-12, 4:18 pm
I will give that a try. Starting today I have legs. So I will max out on legpress. Then go to leg ext and leg curls for 3-4X12

Leg press? Son, this world is getting more feminine by the minute, get yourself under a fucking barbell and squat to ground, and go back up. Repeat. Lower back issues? Fix it.

auburn_1984
04-01-12, 4:34 pm
You are right. I squat but seem to be able to push more weight on leg press. My routine as of now is Hack squat, leg press, leg ext, leg curl, squat. All at 3x8-12. So i will switch the squat to first and place hack squat at last escercise for the workout. I will Squat 5-6 sets at 12/8/8/6/2-4/2-4.

Carrnage
04-01-12, 4:54 pm
You are right. I squat but seem to be able to push more weight on leg press. My routine as of now is Hack squat, leg press, leg ext, leg curl, squat. All at 3x8-12. So i will switch the squat to first and place hack squat at last escercise for the workout. I will Squat 5-6 sets at 12/8/8/6/2-4/2-4.

Push more weight on the leg press? So! Everyone can push hundreds of more pounds than they can on the leg press opposed to squats.

Dude you are way to concerned on impressing / fulfilling your ego. Or is it a different reason? Do you know any hot women that admire you for how much weight you push? Or is it to impress other gym trainees? Lifting heavy weight without precise continuous stretches/contractions without any sort of pause will get you no where.

Time to become a man my friend!

Hope this post motivates the shit outa ya!

Carrnage
04-01-12, 5:27 pm
I havent seen someone mention agmatine on this board lol...
Either way do you take your 4 caps a day? even on non-lifting days? How do you dose it?

I have it in powder form. For most people 1g seems to be the sweet spot. For me, 200-500mg is enough to notice a drastic difference in my pumps.

Joe J
04-01-12, 8:48 pm
Leg press? Son, this world is getting more feminine by the minute, get yourself under a fucking barbell and squat to ground, and go back up. Repeat. Lower back issues? Fix it.

I dare you to say this to Dorian Yates. I would love to see his response.

auburn_1984
04-01-12, 9:15 pm
What eactly is agmatine? I havent heard of it until now. I am changing my leg workout routine around now (that is how much you motivated me just now). I dont care about impressing anyone when in the gym. My whole goal is to get bigger and stronger not to impress the gym bunnies or the guy benching 300+ lbs and only coming down 2-3 inches then back up to lockout. Here is my new leg day.


Squat 5-6setsx 12/8/8/6/2-4/2-4 reps
leg press 4x8-12
leg ext 4x8-12
leg curl 4x8-12
ATG squats 4x8-12
standing calf raises 4x8-12
calf press on leg press 4x8-12

GUNS
04-02-12, 12:37 am
Do leg presses if you want. If you only do squats your body will adapt and stop growing. The likes of Ronnie Coleman, Branch Warren, Dorian Yates, Even Centopani, the list goes on and on, have grown great quads with presses. Its not an ego thing, its not a impress anyone thing, it is a growth thing!

Carrnage
04-02-12, 1:38 am
I dare you to say this to Dorian Yates. I would love to see his response.

Umm ok?

Carrnage
04-02-12, 1:44 am
I dare you to say this to Dorian Yates. I would love to see his response.

I'd love to tell Dorian to put a 2.5 plate under his heels and tell him to squeeze his glutes on the negative/positive while driving through his heels without never coming to a full knee extension, i'd really like to see the look on his face. (yes this can put more stress on your patella tendons, but we are always careful like good boys right? )

But it won't matter, he won a bunch of comps and had a huge pair of quads. Anything can work, if you master the free weight basics via learning from various strength coaches instead of settling for machine substitutes your overall results will be that much greater, obviously I have a point, Evan Centopani, Ronnie Coleman, and Branch Warren woukd probably agree.

Yes I know for the 999999 freakin time Dorian was successful in what he did and what he believed in.

Carrnage
04-02-12, 1:55 am
Do leg presses if you want. If you only do squats your body will adapt and stop growing. The likes of Ronnie Coleman, Branch Warren, Dorian Yates, Even Centopani, the list goes on and on, have grown great quads with presses. Its not an ego thing, its not a impress anyone thing, it is a growth thing!

Your body WILL NOT ADAPT TO DOING A SPECIFIC EXERCISE, your body will adapt via same stresses, by not adjusting the following*

*Volume
*Weight
*Intensity (failure) (even though this isn't a "must" for myofibrillar or sarcoplasmic hypertrophy)
*Tempo

A exercise is just a specific range of motion to what ever primary muscle you are intending to work, whether it offers a biomchanical advantage to fully lengthen or fully shorten the muscle, obviously then theirs the ROM in between not allowing a full stretch/contraction, which would typically be your compound movements.

Obviously for some reason whenever I "correct" someone on these boards, people take it the wrong way and get mad at me for it, but I don't have to worry with GUNS because you can take it like a man! (yes I must state this before further "confusions/mis-understandings" happen again lol)

GUNS
04-02-12, 3:38 am
I agree with you and definately see your point. I just dont want someone getting the wrong idea about it. I dont want them thinking they can squat every single week doing the same reps, same weight, and same ol same ol! More advanced lifters know how to change things up. If someone wants to squat week after week, doing low rep, high weight one week, high rep lower weight the next, I think this is awesome. But I like to change just my first heavy compund out every week. Thats not to say I dont still squat on my leg press day, I do ATG x 12-20 depending on how I feel for a finishing exercise keeping tension just like you said Carrnage.

AJP1
04-02-12, 9:12 am
Your body WILL NOT ADAPT TO DOING A SPECIFIC EXERCISE, your body will adapt via same stresses, by not adjusting the following*

*Volume
*Weight
*Intensity (failure) (even though this isn't a "must" for myofibrillar or sarcoplasmic hypertrophy)
*Tempo

A exercise is just a specific range of motion to what ever primary muscle you are intending to work, whether it offers a biomchanical advantage to fully lengthen or fully shorten the muscle, obviously then theirs the ROM in between not allowing a full stretch/contraction, which would typically be your compound movements.

Obviously for some reason whenever I "correct" someone on these boards, people take it the wrong way and get mad at me for it, but I don't have to worry with GUNS because you can take it like a man! (yes I must state this before further "confusions/mis-understandings" happen again lol)


Makes sense to me.

auburn_1984
04-02-12, 9:45 am
Workouted out legs tonight. Got amazing pump in my quads. I am not a very strong squater so needless to say i havent squatted in awhile. Here was tonights workout.

Squats 135x12 185x8 205x6 225x4 225x4
Leg Press 610x15 695x15 785x12 + 3 partial reps
Leg Ext 130x14 145 x 12 190x8 + 3 partial reps
Stifflegged deadlift 135x12 155x12 225x6
seated leg curl 100x14 130x12+3 partial reps 155x 8 +4 partial reps
calfpress on legpress 520x12 520x14 520x12+4 partial reps

I got chest tomorrow and hoping to get the same pump that i got from legs tonight.

Joe J
04-02-12, 10:10 am
I'd love to tell Dorian to put a 2.5 plate under his heels and tell him to squeeze his glutes on the negative/positive while driving through his heels without never coming to a full knee extension, i'd really like to see the look on his face. (yes this can put more stress on your patella tendons, but we are always careful like good boys right? )

But it won't matter, he won a bunch of comps and had a huge pair of quads. Anything can work, if you master the free weight basics via learning from various strength coaches instead of settling for machine substitutes your overall results will be that much greater, obviously I have a point, Evan Centopani, Ronnie Coleman, and Branch Warren woukd probably agree.

Yes I know for the 999999 freakin time Dorian was successful in what he did and what he believed in.

Needless to say I disagree, good job this board is for discussion right? I've never seen the squat as a particularly efficient movement for ME PERSONALLY, especially at the beginning of a workout.

"Some people's joints articulate in a manner that allows them to benefit greatly from squats; others may not benefit at all. If you're not too tall and have short limbs, it may be the best exercise for you, but if you're tall with long legs, it might be both ineffective and dangerous. I was stubbornly faithful to squats for years until I finally realized they were not well-suited for my body structure. After I switched to more muscle-intensive movements, my gains in leg size were astounding."

GUNS
04-02-12, 11:31 am
Joe J, What movements do you do now?

Auburn, thats a fine number for squats. Keep 225 as your heaviest set till your at 10-12, then move up. I also recommend some high rep, low weight days. Try squatting with 135 for 5-6 sets of 20. If you have to go lighter, then do so, but the higher reps will make you grow as well!

Joe J
04-02-12, 3:09 pm
Joe J, What movements do you do now?

Auburn, thats a fine number for squats. Keep 225 as your heaviest set till your at 10-12, then move up. I also recommend some high rep, low weight days. Try squatting with 135 for 5-6 sets of 20. If you have to go lighter, then do so, but the higher reps will make you grow as well!

Guns, in my current leg routine I do these movements in this order:

Leg Extension
Leg Press
Hack Squat
Stiff Legged DL
Lying Ham Curls

AJP1
04-02-12, 4:59 pm
If you achieve a massive pump, does that entail that the work out was good?

Some people say the "pump" is a sign or growth & other say it means nothing.

Carrnage
04-02-12, 6:58 pm
I agree with you and definately see your point. I just dont want someone getting the wrong idea about it. I dont want them thinking they can squat every single week doing the same reps, same weight, and same ol same ol! More advanced lifters know how to change things up. If someone wants to squat week after week, doing low rep, high weight one week, high rep lower weight the next, I think this is awesome. But I like to change just my first heavy compund out every week. Thats not to say I dont still squat on my leg press day, I do ATG x 12-20 depending on how I feel for a finishing exercise keeping tension just like you said Carrnage.

Right on!

Why do people call it "ATG", just call it a friggin' squat! lol just messin, I suppose their are still people out there doing half squats right haha

Carrnage
04-02-12, 7:21 pm
Joe J, What movements do you do now?

Auburn, thats a fine number for squats. Keep 225 as your heaviest set till your at 10-12, then move up. I also recommend some high rep, low weight days. Try squatting with 135 for 5-6 sets of 20. If you have to go lighter, then do so, but the higher reps will make you grow as well!

Some solid advice right there!

Carrnage
04-02-12, 7:25 pm
Needless to say I disagree, good job this board is for discussion right? I've never seen the squat as a particularly efficient movement for ME PERSONALLY, especially at the beginning of a workout.

"Some people's joints articulate in a manner that allows them to benefit greatly from squats; others may not benefit at all. If you're not too tall and have short limbs, it may be the best exercise for you, but if you're tall with long legs, it might be both ineffective and dangerous. I was stubbornly faithful to squats for years until I finally realized they were not well-suited for my body structure. After I switched to more muscle-intensive movements, my gains in leg size were astounding."

Nope, some people's joints articulate in a manner that prevents certain ranges of motion. Which can be fixed via strength coaches. You should look into one of Charles Poliquin's next seminars, he will make you master faster/easier than you could imagine. Most people just have the mindset you have towards certain exercises and give up on them, obviously you have found exercises that aided in hypertrophy, like I always state, you don't need focus on the free weight basics, but if you, your overall long term results will be that much greater. Oh and....its only the few that do.

Carrnage
04-02-12, 7:31 pm
If you achieve a massive pump, does that entail that the work out was good?

Some people say the "pump" is a sign or growth & other say it means nothing.

Check out my post on this, I believe it was number 6 on this thread.

The workout was "good"? Im sure if you mean productive going towards your goals. A pump just means you are training the targeted muscle, and lactic acid will build up. The workout can be considered "good" / "productive" if you are progressively overloading your cns/muscles and supplying your body with enough raw nutrients. A pump will somewhat enhance nutrient delivery, but nutrient delivery is great for hypertrophy if you are overloading your cns with a steady supply of nutrients.