View Full Version : Beta-Alanine now illegal?
rev8ball
04-16-12, 11:06 am
Unbelievable. Last Nov, a company (whose board of directors is nothing but lawyers and former bank owners) was somehow able to get a patent on BA. Totally snuck in under the radar. And I'm not talking about a "Proprietary Blend" either. We are talking about the basic amino acid, plain and simple, used in "sport supplmentation." Wow - a bit broad, eh?
After they did this, they started filing law suits against supplement companies who are using BA but not buying it from their authorized distributor. Can you imagine the future implications of this on other supplements if these companies lose their court battles? Guess it just goes to show what you're able to accomplish when you suck enough gov dick.....
http://www.nutraingredients-usa.com/Regulation/There-are-more-infringing-companies-out-there-says-lawyer-in-latest-beta-alanine-patent-lawsuits
Mr. Dead
04-16-12, 11:21 am
Just when I thought I had seen it all... Wow...
Bruiser
04-16-12, 11:37 am
Now is this for ALL BA9 or just a specific version of it, the way they were patenting certain creatines for a while?
rev8ball
04-16-12, 12:10 pm
Now is this for ALL BA9 or just a specific version of it, the way they were patenting certain creatines for a while?
The definition of the patent is pretty broad. Here is just part of it:
“… provides compositions comprising beta-alanine, peptides of beta-alanine, analogues and derivatives thereof, beta-alanylhistidine dipeptides (e.g., carnosine, anserine, and balenine) and methods using these compositions for increasing the anaerobic working capacity of a tissue comprising providing an amount of beta-alanine to blood or blood plasma effective to increase beta-alanylhistidine dipeptide synthesis in a tissue. Beta-alanylhistidine dipeptides can include peptides of beta-alanine, such as carnosine, anserine, and balenine.
The composition can include carbohydrates (e.g., simple carbohydrates), insulin, or agents that stimulate the production of insulin. Compositions can also include glycine, insulin, insulin mimics, and/or insulin-action modifies.
The compositions can be a dietary supplement that can be ingested, injected, or absorbed through the skin….”
This is some bullshit.
So should I start stocking up on Beta Ala9?
Yep--All companies must use the patented form of beta alanine or should expect to be taken to court. We actually have been buying it but only recently started to update the labels to reflect the patent wording.
TigerAce01
04-16-12, 12:34 pm
Ridiculous...what's the cost of using a patented ingredient? And what is the process of using said ingredient in a product?
-Ace
C.Coronato
04-17-12, 1:10 pm
Thats insane, but nice way to make money lol.
Mr. Dead
04-17-12, 1:37 pm
BRB... Putting a patent on steak...
marshiboi
04-17-12, 2:45 pm
Absolute craziness, I was going to say "how can you possibly put a patent on a natural occuring amino acid!"
Then I just looked at the particular brand I'm taking and realised it's using "CarnoSyn®" which "is a registered trademark of NAI, Inc. USA Patents: 5,965,596; 6,172,098B1; 6,426,361B2."
Just goes to show, I had no idea!
I definately don't agree with the fact they're suing other companies using beta-alanine or it's derivatives as an ingredient, they should welcome the competition instead of stifling it.
rev8ball
04-17-12, 2:52 pm
Then I just looked at the particular brand I'm taking and realised it's using "CarnoSyn®" which "is a registered trademark of NAI, Inc. USA Patents: 5,965,596; 6,172,098B1; 6,426,361B2."
That's the beasty right there.....
TigerAce01
04-17-12, 3:27 pm
BRB... Putting a patent on steak...
I just applied for a patent on a new protein/carb supplement. It also contains healthy fats. It is a completely natural supplement with undenatured proteins. In studies, it has caused extreme muscle growth.
I wanted to call it: MILK.
-Ace
BigChrisF
04-17-12, 4:02 pm
BRB... Putting a patent on steak...
Too late. I already patented cattle and all their derivatives. It's patent number 5UCK1T3V3RY1.
Mr. Dead
04-17-12, 4:38 pm
I just applied for a patent on a new protein/carb supplement. It also contains healthy fats. It is a completely natural supplement with undenatured proteins. In studies, it has caused extreme muscle growth.
I wanted to call it: MILK.
-Ace
Too late. I already patented cattle and all their derivatives. It's patent number 5UCK1T3V3RY1.
Fine, then... I'm getting a patent on the oxygen molecule... And another for atoms...
TigerAce01
04-17-12, 4:44 pm
I call carbon and any molecules that contains said element.
-Ace
rev8ball
04-17-12, 4:55 pm
Fine, then... I'm getting a patent on the oxygen molecule... And another for atoms...
Damn, and I was happy with my patent on dihydrogen monoxide ......
Mr. Dead
04-17-12, 4:57 pm
Damn, and I was happy with my patent on dihydrogen monoxide ......
I'm evil and greedy...
rev8ball
04-17-12, 4:59 pm
I'm evil and greedy...
Nah.
But seriously, wouldn't be great sometimes to have the same mentality people like this have?
Bank........
Universal Rep
04-23-12, 9:09 am
Mebbe I have a diff opinion than most, but I think it's a good thing for companies in general to get patents for ingredients/compounds in the supp industry...
TigerAce01
04-23-12, 12:27 pm
Mebbe I have a diff opinion than most, but I think it's a good thing for companies in general to get patents for ingredients/compounds in the supp industry...
I think for a very specific engineered molecule, yes...but beta alanine?? A very simple ingredient that's been used for years, and cheaply at that?
-Ace
Beowulf
04-23-12, 12:30 pm
I think for a very specific engineered molecule, yes...but beta alanine?? A very simple ingredient that's been used for years, and cheaply at that?
-Ace
Cheaply? Why was that? For years? Why was that? Because companies skirted patents? Just because you can doesn't mean you should. This all benefits consumers and companies who engage in the practice, but this doesn't necessarily benefit the supplement industry.
TigerAce01
04-23-12, 12:44 pm
Cheaply? Why was that? For years? Why was that? Because companies skirted patents? Just because you can doesn't mean you should. This all benefits consumers and companies who engage in the practice, but this doesn't necessarily benefit the supplement industry.
What exactly are you asking me?
I was saying that it's fine to patent an ingredient when the company itself created the molecule, like Sustamine for example. But beta alanine is a simple base molecule that has been around for an extremely long time, and has been cheaply and effectively added to many supplements.
-Ace
rev8ball
04-23-12, 1:26 pm
But beta alanine... has been around for an extremely long time...
Like......... Forever!
Appollonian
04-23-12, 1:27 pm
BRB... Putting a patent on steak...
LOL... this is one of my most favorites posts ever. Thanks Mr. Dead!
Mebbe I have a diff opinion than most, but I think it's a good thing for companies in general to get patents for ingredients/compounds in the supp industry...
Personally I think that you should be able to patent a compound that recquires a specific process to develop. I will admit I know very little about the manufacturing process behind how supplements are produced, but to me as an automotive manufacturing engineer would be like putting a patent out on steel. Not a specific process for deriving or producing said steel, but any and all steel (yes the methods for making steel have been patented, but I'm trying to make a point). Can you explain why you think it's a good idea that individual ingredients are patented? Quality/safety reasons perhaps?
twoheadedboy
05-20-12, 6:59 am
Mebbe I have a diff opinion than most, but I think it's a good thing for companies in general to get patents for ingredients/compounds in the supp industry...
A patented item, by definition, cannot be a trade secret; the formula and science behind it must be disclosed and anyone can see it. I'm not sure what's stopping anyone from patenting anything now, but it seems that most supplement companies, Universal included, are going the trade secret route rather than the patent route...my guess is because if people are smart enough to change a steroid by one molecule and make it semi-legal for a while, they can do the same with supplements too and affect the competitive marketplace.
I am all for patents that advance our understanding of the world and our quality of life, meaning they are used for something other than attack litigation. And software patents are just stupid....but I digress!