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Menelol
10-31-13, 6:53 am
I've read from animal reps that Pak increases the effectiveness 'potentiates' if you will, other animal supplements.

Now I'm wondering how true this is and I'm wondering if you can link me to a post that shows this.

I want to believe this isn't just marketing so here we go:

Which products does Pak increase the effectiveness of the most?
Also can you give me a comprehensive list of which stacks or products are safe for someone who is 18/19 years of age
so obviously that leaves animal test and stak out of the question.


In conclusion: I'd like to know what animal supplement pak 'potentates' the most.

Firefist
10-31-13, 8:38 am
While someone could go through the ingredients list and break down every little detail, my take on your question is pretty simple.

Pak is a foundational supplement, and a damn good one at that. With all the vitamins, minerals, support, etc, it keeps your body running at a heightened state compared to not taking Pak. A more efficient body processes supplements much more effectively. Obviously then, stacking other supplements while taking Pak or not taking Pak could be a huge difference.

If you got a wicked fast car and don't put in gasoline or even worse, spend money on cheap stuff, then how are all the aftermarket parts you put in gonna help ya?

Menelol
10-31-13, 8:48 am
I gotchar metaphor, but are stak and test the only products I should stay away from as someone under 25?

Thanks.

Firefist
10-31-13, 9:10 am
I gotchar metaphor, but are stak and test the only products I should stay away from as someone under 25?

Thanks.

That's correct. As for the rest of the Animal/Universal line, Animal and pretty much every other major supplement company, recommends you only use supplements when 18 years of age, along with lots of good food, heavy training and recovery. Its not necessarily that stak or test will harm you if you take it before the recommendation, its just that at your current age, your body is overflowing with test and all that good stuff that stak/test help promote. In essence, we'd rather you spend money on food and protein powder than on supplements that won't help you much.

However, a great alternative to stak/test is m-stak.

http://www.animalpak.com/html/sections.cfm?ID=9

G Diesel
10-31-13, 9:15 am
While someone could go through the ingredients list and break down every little detail, my take on your question is pretty simple.

Pak is a foundational supplement, and a damn good one at that. With all the vitamins, minerals, support, etc, it keeps your body running at a heightened state compared to not taking Pak. A more efficient body processes supplements much more effectively. Obviously then, stacking other supplements while taking Pak or not taking Pak could be a huge difference.

If you got a wicked fast car and don't put in gasoline or even worse, spend money on cheap stuff, then how are all the aftermarket parts you put in gonna help ya?

Really well said. A body without vitamin and mineral deficiencies will absorb, process and assimilate other nutrients better. Same can be said for a well-hydrated body.

Peace, G

Menelol
10-31-13, 9:21 am
That's correct. As for the rest of the Animal/Universal line, Animal and pretty much every other major supplement company, recommends you only use supplements when 18 years of age, along with lots of good food, heavy training and recovery. Its not necessarily that stak or test will harm you if you take it before the recommendation, its just that at your current age, your body is overflowing with test and all that good stuff that stak/test help promote. In essence, we'd rather you spend money on food and protein powder than on supplements that won't help you much.

However, a great alternative to stak/test is m-stak.

http://www.animalpak.com/html/sections.cfm?ID=9
Great, thinking about staking m-stak with pump and maybe some non-animal PWO until the new rage comes out.

Is that fine? I mean taking pump and a non animal PWO until the new rage comes out.

Firefist
10-31-13, 9:28 am
Great, thinking about staking m-stak with pump and maybe some non-animal PWO until the new rage comes out.

Is that fine? I mean taking pump and a non animal PWO until the new rage comes out.

Haha I'm not the right person to ask that question. being an Animal purist and rage junkie. I don't know how anything could possibly make rage better, but the guys in Jersey have been known to whip up some cool shit, so I am anxiously awaiting RageXL as well.

To answer your question though, sure you can run any pre workout you like with pump and expect good results. I would advise however, that you remove the red pill from your pack of pump as that one is the stimulant pill. The pre-workout you chose will most likely be chock-full of stims already, and sometimes, too much of a good thing can be bad.

Nix0r
10-31-13, 10:00 am
Great, thinking about staking m-stak with pump and maybe some non-animal PWO until the new rage comes out.

Is that fine? I mean taking pump and a non animal PWO until the new rage comes out.

Honestly, I wouldn't even bother with M-Stak right now. Use that money to buy steak. At 18, your supplement intake should be minimal; just worry about the basics. You should be focusing on training and eating like a boss.


Haha I'm not the right person to ask that question. being an Animal purist and rage junkie. I don't know how anything could possibly make rage better, but the guys in Jersey have been known to whip up some cool shit, so I am anxiously awaiting RageXL as well.

To answer your question though, sure you can run any pre workout you like with pump and expect good results. I would advise however, that you remove the red pill from your pack of pump as that one is the stimulant pill. The pre-workout you chose will most likely be chock-full of stims already, and sometimes, too much of a good thing can be bad.

What FF said. No reason you couldn't take a different company's pre-workout with pump, but just watch the caffeine intake. I never really bothered mixing up pre-workout products, because you're gonna find a lot of overlap between each of them.

Menelol
10-31-13, 10:14 am
Honestly, I wouldn't even bother with M-Stak right now. Use that money to buy steak. At 18, your supplement intake should be minimal; just worry about the basics. You should be focusing on training and eating like a boss.



What FF said. No reason you couldn't take a different company's pre-workout with pump, but just watch the caffeine intake. I never really bothered mixing up pre-workout products, because you're gonna find a lot of overlap between each of them.


I appreciate your concern, but It begs the question

Will m-stak nullify any of my hormones when I'm off of it?

I don't think you understand, I really want to take m-stak, like I dream at night about taking animal products...

Firefist
10-31-13, 10:28 am
I appreciate your concern, but It begs the question

Will m-stak nullify any of my hormones when I'm off of it?

I don't think you understand, I really want to take m-stak, like I dream at night about taking animal products...

Haha I get it man, I was 18 at one time and was hellbent on getting heavy into supplements too.

Nixor is right though, I probably shouldnt have even mentioned M-stak (I get excited about Animal products that I like haha).

Some members were having a discussion on the subject actually the other day. The general consensus is that if we all could go back to when we were younger and/or starting out, our supplementation would have been much more basic, as with our training. We would have spent a lot more time eating and sleeping, and less time looking into ingredient labels and ads in the muscle magazines, or staying up hella late doing who knows what. Thats not to say that supplements arent important. There's just other things that take priority.

That's where this forum is a bit unconventional compared to other ones. We'd rather you make long term commitments to achieving your goals than push you to buy this or that product.

World Eater
10-31-13, 10:42 am
I appreciate your concern, but It begs the question

Will m-stak nullify any of my hormones when I'm off of it?

I don't think you understand, I really want to take m-stak, like I dream at night about taking animal products...

You might be confusing M-Stak with Stak. M-Stak as far as I know doesn't influence hormones at all - it simply lets your body use nutritients more effectively, thus promoting strenght and muscle growth (when eating a calorie surplus).

Menelol
10-31-13, 10:43 am
That's where this forum is a bit unconventional compared to other ones. We'd rather you make long term commitments to achieving your goals than push you to buy this or that product.

Haha I can relate.

Nix0r
10-31-13, 10:43 am
I appreciate your concern, but It begs the question

Will m-stak nullify any of my hormones when I'm off of it?

I don't think you understand, I really want to take m-stak, like I dream at night about taking animal products...

M-Stak is completely non-hormonal, so there isn't anything to worry about there.

What you should really be asking yourself, is what do you expect to gain from a can of M-Stak? Are you trying to pack on some pounds and are having difficulty?

Menelol
10-31-13, 10:58 am
M-Stak is completely non-hormonal, so there isn't anything to worry about there.

What you should really be asking yourself, is what do you expect to gain from a can of M-Stak? Are you trying to pack on some pounds and are having difficulty?
Put on some lean mass quicker, just looking for something more than Pak, pwo and fish oil honestly but who knows pump might do the trick.

Nix0r
10-31-13, 11:10 am
Put on some lean mass quicker, just looking for something more than Pak, pwo and fish oil honestly but who knows pump might do the trick.

Adding M-Stak alone isn't going to fix that problem for you. M-Stak, in addition to a rock-solid diet... definitely can. Can you post up what you eat in a given day? That's gonna be the biggest thing.

Menelol
10-31-13, 11:15 am
Adding M-Stak alone isn't going to fix that problem for you. M-Stak, in addition to a rock-solid diet... definitely can. Can you post up what you eat in a given day? That's gonna be the biggest thing.

Well I always calculate my meals but mostly chicken breast, complex carb powder, anythign that fits my macros on this bulk
but If I was on m-stack or cutting (omit carbs and sub in olive oil on a cut) I would probably eat:

Oats
Eggs and rice
tuna and veg
steak and wholegrains
Post-workout massgainer
Chicken
and milk before bed

Bruiser
10-31-13, 11:19 am
Well I always calculate my meals but mostly chicken breast, complex carb powder, anythign that fits my macros on this bulk
but If I was on m-stack or cutting (omit carbs and sub in olive oil on a cut) I would probably eat:

Oats
Eggs and rice
tuna and veg
steak and wholegrains
Post-workout massgainer
Chicken
and milk before bed

Why do you need to take M-Stak in order to eat like this? Just eat this and add in a glass of milk with every meal. Done.

Menelol
10-31-13, 8:45 pm
Why do you need to take M-Stak in order to eat like this? Just eat this and add in a glass of milk with every meal. Done.
what?
That'd just make me fat...
I meant this is my example of a cutting diet, my bulking diet is a lot more varied

Swolepez
11-01-13, 12:45 am
Fuck off ****, go grief somewhere else.

I'm bulking on milk currently, idiot



Hey brother, no need for that here on this forvm.

Trust the people on here with what they are telling you, they're veterans in this game and have been through it all.

M-Stak ONLY works if you have your diet, training & rest in proper place first. Supps in general work in this manner.

Trust me, i'm only 22 and still got a lot to learn but I wish I would have found this forvm about 2 yrs ago when I got serious in weight training. I can't tell you how much money I wasted on supps bc I thought I had to try every thing that came out lol. But let me tell you, it didn't replace bad training, a half ass diet and little sleep. I learned the hard way. And now that I'm married and out of college with $19,000 in debt due to college loans....I had to figure out quick that most of the money for bodybuilding goals should go to food.
M-Stak is a supp, a great one at that, but it's not a miracle pill. It only works when your diet is top notch in quality and calorie wise. At your age Animal Pak and a protein powder are really all you need. Food is what gets you shredded or jacked, again trust me I learned this the hard way. I've wasted so much money on supps and fancy crap. These guys on the forvm are trying to put you in the best position to see gains and save your money at the same time.

Trying all the fancy supps got me to 180ish lbs....as soon as put I diet number 1 and focused on a training that worked for me = now i'm 207lbs at 5'7 with my top 4 abs visible.


Will M-Stak hurt you? No. Will it be beneficial for you at this time? Maybe (depends if you got the basics down right). Is M-Stak needed? Not at all.

Diet>Training>Rest/Recovery>Then supps.

machineman
11-01-13, 7:21 am
Fuck off ****, go grief somewhere else.

I'm bulking on milk currently, idiot

Easy now, we are here to help. The question posed to you was to post up what you eat on a given day. There was no clarification that you were posting your cutting diet while you are currently on a bulk. That isn't going to help us much.

What are your macros? I hate to tell you, there is no "quick" way to add lean mass. And if you think Pump is going to do this for you, you need to learn a little more first. I am not saying this trying to be a dick, but you need to learn what each of these supps do, how they do it and how best to utilize them. As others have said, us vets would LOVE to go back to 18 or 19 and start over knowing what we know now. We can't but what we can do is pass along the knowledge that we have gained in the hopes that others will listen to us and learn from our mistakes.