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ckampf14
02-09-08, 2:44 pm
In previous posts Ox mentioned that he didnt drink diet soda when cutting because it seems like it messes with people's metabolism. According to this NY Times article, drinking diet soda may lead to "metabolic syndrome."

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/05/health/nutrition/05symp.html?em&ex=1202706000&en=093ffabf372716aa&ei=5087%0A

Feel The Power
02-09-08, 7:19 pm
wow. i appreciate this link. always wondered what was up with that. I'm going to do my best to make it to the arnold (weather permitting). Can't wait to make my first trip to the cage!!


In previous posts Ox mentioned that he didnt drink diet soda when cutting because it seems like it messes with people's metabolism. According to this NY Times article, drinking diet soda may lead to "metabolic syndrome."

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/05/health/nutrition/05symp.html?em&ex=1202706000&en=093ffabf372716aa&ei=5087%0A

Ox
02-10-08, 1:17 pm
In previous posts Ox mentioned that he didnt drink diet soda when cutting because it seems like it messes with people's metabolism. According to this NY Times article, drinking diet soda may lead to "metabolic syndrome."

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/05/health/nutrition/05symp.html?em&ex=1202706000&en=093ffabf372716aa&ei=5087%0A

Interesting article...my guess is that it may in fact be more "behavior related" but I still don't trust the chemicals...I think they fuck people up.

Ox
02-10-08, 1:22 pm
Ox...
Need your opinion on pre-workout based powders.

Pump has really be slacking on me lately (either I haven't been taking it on an empty enough stomach or what) but I just don't feel it as of lately.

What do powders like Shock Therapy do to ketosis?
It has about 8g of Carbs, but they aren't from sugar or anything.

8G OF CARBS.
I use Pump but not every day. I use storm pre workout on most days and use storm + pump on leg and back days. Bottom line is that your body adapts to stimulants and you need to cycle them. If you rely on them evry day for a boost the effects will obviously become less and less noticable. Rotate it with something else. You should not NEED a stimulant induced boost EVERY day if your diet, sleep, mind set etc are in order.

Hollywood
02-10-08, 1:33 pm
Ox,

You still train at Golds NH?? I was there for the ABC a few weeks back, real nice gym and close to my house. I'm thinking about gettin a membership for the summer when I'm home.

humanforklift
02-11-08, 11:12 am
Hey Evan, i was wondering what type of diet cycles you suggest for an amatuer bodybuilder who isnt yet ready to compete. I've tried the keotgenic last summer and have been bulking for the last few months. I'm thinking about cutting a bit since I've adding weight and increaded poundages in several mass lifts. Should I carb cycle now as my cardio increases? Should I go back to the ketogenic diet for 4 months? I'm still experimenting with diets and carb manipulation to see how my body will respond.

Also, I rehead most of my meals at work during the day. What foods have you found that reheat well? Most of my meals include chicken or top round steak...both arent great once reheated....not that it matters because I wash it down with water. Just wanted your opinion...

Thanks for the time

shortstack
02-11-08, 11:32 am
Other than that stuff I'm just lookin forward to checkin out the Arnold and hangin at the Animal cage...it's gonna be a blast. Any of you guys goin?

I'll be there and look forward to meeting you, as well as the other animals in the cage.

Mr.Totality
02-11-08, 11:42 am
This thread has been created in honor of the sport of bodybuilding and everything that goes along with it. I'm here to talk about training, nutrition, the bodybuilding lifestlye and anything and everything in between. We all have our own reasons for sacrificing our time and energy but, ultimately, we're all here because we believe in something. We all have the undying belief that there is some sort of satisfaction to be gained from all the sweat and the pain and the sacrifice. Something that can't be bought for any price or taken away at any cost. We are all bound by this common belief. I'm honored to be amongst all of you. It is my most sincere aspiration that I can share with you what I've learned and that it may be of some value to you. I look forward to talking to you guys. Peace.

awesome honor for us

Diabolus
02-11-08, 6:43 pm
I just had my first cheat meal last night, my question is: Is it normal to feel sluggish and tired the next day?, maybe I did something wrong?. To give you an idea, I had 2 bowls of rice pilaf w/ steamed veggies and 4 cookies w/ a couple spoonfuls of peanut butter, in all, it came to
about a little over 200g of carbs. Any advice or assurance that I did/didn't fuck up would be
very appreciated. Thanks yet again.

Ox
02-11-08, 7:27 pm
Ox,

You still train at Golds NH?? I was there for the ABC a few weeks back, real nice gym and close to my house. I'm thinking about gettin a membership for the summer when I'm home.


Hell yeah I do...I love that gym. It's totally worth making the trip there especially if you're home for the summer. I drive 20-30 min every day to go there and it's 110% worth it. Besides, those guys don't charge much for a membership and they always have student specials.

Ox
02-11-08, 7:32 pm
Hey Evan, i was wondering what type of diet cycles you suggest for an amatuer bodybuilder who isnt yet ready to compete. I've tried the keotgenic last summer and have been bulking for the last few months. I'm thinking about cutting a bit since I've adding weight and increaded poundages in several mass lifts. Should I carb cycle now as my cardio increases? Should I go back to the ketogenic diet for 4 months? I'm still experimenting with diets and carb manipulation to see how my body will respond.

Also, I rehead most of my meals at work during the day. What foods have you found that reheat well? Most of my meals include chicken or top round steak...both arent great once reheated....not that it matters because I wash it down with water. Just wanted your opinion...

Thanks for the time

If you want to lean out I would just clean everything up and make sure you're eating very simple foods and I would cut back on the carbs (not eliminate them totally) and do some cardio. I have never carb cycled before so I can't help you much there. I really don't like the idea of ups and downs...I think it screws with your head too much.
As for food that reheats well...I think that anything reheated in a microwave tastes like shit! If your using a stove anything should taste ok reheated...except red meat...that tastes crappy reheated. But honestly I never reheat anything...I just eat it cold...it really doesn't matter that much to mne anymore.

Ox
02-11-08, 7:33 pm
Out of curiosity, what does a high fat/protein day while you're cutting for a show look like? What foods do you consider a staple during this time?

Here's what my diet looks like pre-contest:

Meal 1: 6 Whole eggs (Eggland's Best)

Meal 2: 1.5 scoops Universal Egg Protein, 1.5 Scoops Universal Specialized Protein for gaining lean Mass, 2 tbsp all natural peanut butter

Meal 3: 8 oz chicken, 2 cups green salad, 1/2 cup raw almonds

Meal 4: same as meal 2

Meal 5: 8 oz salmon, 2 cups green salad, 1tbsp olive oli

Meal 6: same as meals 2+4



ev- im a college kid, so i can cook the fish and chicken on the weekend but keepin the eggs is a little tough, would it be alright to make meal one the same as 2?

Yeah...the meals are interchangable.

Ox
02-11-08, 7:34 pm
I just had my first cheat meal last night, my question is: Is it normal to feel sluggish and tired the next day?, maybe I did something wrong?. To give you an idea, I had 2 bowls of rice pilaf w/ steamed veggies and 4 cookies w/ a couple spoonfuls of peanut butter, in all, it came to
about a little over 200g of carbs. Any advice or assurance that I did/didn't fuck up would be
very appreciated. Thanks yet again.

You really can't fuck it up. Some people feel good the next day, some not so good. I usually feel more like what you are describing. You're fine. You might want to be careful what foods you mix because it can upset your stomach but there really are no rules as to what you eat.

REBORN1
02-11-08, 7:39 pm
ox-
ive been watching the clips of you and guy cisternino train before the nationals on md.com, in the trenches, i wanted to say your delts are insane, i was wondering what your shoulder workout looks like, and do you believe in the pre-exhausting the delts like guy does before pressing?

Latimer316
02-11-08, 7:40 pm
Hey Ox, quick question man. I'm going to be doing a show the third week of june and the dieting scene for a contest is all new to me. Would the diet you used to prepare for the show be ok for me to try. I'm currently 205lbs wanting to get down around 180 or so. I appreciate any help you can be on this. Thanks man.

krazyassmexican
02-11-08, 7:42 pm
ox-
ive been watching the clips of you and guy cisternino train before the nationals on md.com, in the trenches, i wanted to say your delts are insane, i was wondering what your shoulder workout looks like, and do you believe in the pre-exhausting the delts like guy does before pressing?

on the trenches videos there are two parts of evan and guy
one is shoulders and the other one is back
you may wanna look it up

REBORN1
02-11-08, 7:49 pm
yea thats what i am talking about, im just wondering if that is your normal shoulder routine, b.c i remember you or guy saying something b.c it was a little different b.c you were a week out from a show, just wanted to see what your normal shoulder looks like

Diabolus
02-11-08, 9:03 pm
You really can't fuck it up. Some people feel good the next day, some not so good. I usually feel more like what you are describing. You're fine. You might want to be careful what foods you mix because it can upset your stomach but there really are no rules as to what you eat.

Awesome, thank you. I was worried I messed up but it's great to know I'm still on the right track. You hit it right on the nail about food combinations, my stomach was upset that night and early into next day, I'll be more conscious of that next time around. Other than that,
everything is going the way it's supposed to, energy and strength is going up and the b.f is going down. Thank you again for all your help with the diet, I've tried a high protein diet before and it was a miserable experience, this one actually works and you feel great as well!

ROC1291
02-12-08, 7:50 pm
Tomorrow I will be in Ketosis...
And can i say I lifted today for the first time on whatever was left in my system.
I might already be there since my breath smells kind of weird and my piss has become pale white and makes strange bubbles haha.

All I can say is, I had a great lift today for back and hit all my weight.
I am feeling better I think without carbs than with them.

It may be too early too tell, but I'm doing this for 4 weeks until I go to Florida for 5 days.
After I get back from Florida I will be going back on this ketosis for 4 months.

All I can say is, thanks for everything Ox.
You've been a great help and inspiration for me.

Thetasteofink69
02-12-08, 9:35 pm
I dont think you have to go keto... just clean things up. I would say that if you are eating QUALITY proteins, carbs and fats at each meal and you throw in some cardio and train with intensity you will tighten up just fine. the key is QUALITY foods. All home cooked stuff. No school lunches, no eating out, no keg parties!

Alright awesome.. Thanks a lot man..

One more thing.. I recently decided that I'm gona take a short break from my bulk, and just go on a really quick cut.. Anywhere from 2-4 weeks..

Do you think I should consider giving a keto diet a test drive during this time? Or is it not worth it, being as it's such a short cut.. I'd like to try to it out, just to see how it works out for me, but I'd rather do what will give me better results

ChandlerXJ
02-13-08, 10:12 pm
Ev, how's it going... D - day is just a few weeks away... I'm going to be ordering all my supplies this week...

Whey Protein Isolate
BCAA's for workout, post workout (before cardio)
Pak
Uni-Liver
EEA Stack - for sipping between meals (is this necessary?)
Storm ( Less than 1 carb )

The only thing I'm lost on is how I should implement the EFA's and which ones to get, when to take them.

Also, what I should be taking for vascularity... NOX3? Starting 8 weeks out?

I donno.. just sort of venting - any advice for pre-contest supplementation would be awesome man...

In the mean time, take it easy ... I'm gonna have a whole new journey with pictures and stuff taking me from d-day to the show... I'll keep you posted on that.

Thanks Ev

Ozkar
02-14-08, 12:27 pm
Personally, I would opt for the M-Stak. Lots of good ananbolic hormone optimizers + aminos and no anti-aromatase stuff. No doubt.

Hey Ox, its me again, quick question, is Universal's Natural Sterol Complex similar to Stak2? I've read the ingredients and I know they aren't the same, but I'm not as experienced or knowledgeable enough to know exactly what differentiates both of them just by reading their description. What does the Natural Sterol Complex do?

Thanks so much for your time bro, I really appreciate it.

ANDROTAZ
02-14-08, 3:09 pm
Ox, got a question, bro.

I'm on keto right now, and I just saw how you have 3 shakes and 3 solid meals a day...I do the same thing, but I'm having trouble with shit I can add to my protein to get the fat content up. I see that you use natural PB, but even just peanuts (with no sugar added) have 5 or 6g of carbs x 3 per day...that's a possible 18g of carbs just from that, plus unless you get a pure whey isolate, there's gonna be about 3g of carbs in the protein, so that's another 9g a day. I try to keep carbs under 20g ED...

Now. My idea was to use heavy cream with my shakes, which I've done before...however, that means that between the cream x3, my last meal (eggs and sausage), and my 8 oz. of beef, a lot of that fat is saturated. I'm not one of those people who obsess over saturated fat at all, in fact I welcome it...that shit's anabolic in my mind, but how bad would it be for such a large portion OF my fats to be saturated vs. say, the unsaturated ones in nuts and oils?

thanks a ton, man.

krazyassmexican
02-14-08, 3:11 pm
Ox, got a question, bro.

I'm on keto right now, and I just saw how you have 3 shakes and 3 solid meals a day...I do the same thing, but I'm having trouble with shit I can add to my protein to get the fat content up. I see that you use natural PB, but even just peanuts (with no sugar added) have 5 or 6g of carbs x 3 per day...that's a possible 18g of carbs just from that, plus unless you get a pure whey isolate, there's gonna be about 3g of carbs in the protein, so that's another 9g a day. I try to keep carbs under 20g ED...

Now. My idea was to use heavy cream with my shakes, which I've done before...however, that means that between the cream x3, my last meal (eggs and sausage), and my 8 oz. of beef, a lot of that fat is saturated. I'm not one of those people who obsess over saturated fat at all, in fact I welcome it...that shit's anabolic in my mind, but how bad would it be for such a large portion OF my fats to be saturated vs. say, the unsaturated ones in nuts and oils?

thanks a ton, man.

how about you use healthy fats like extra virgin olive oil
mac nut oil or almonds?
by the way ox has 3 whole meals and 3 shakes

mark_Lamb
02-14-08, 3:39 pm
hey bro ive been dieting for a show which is coming up in a little over 9weeks and ive been hearing a lot about your progress with the ketosis diets and ive been actually using one for the past 6 weeks thing is i dont use any cheat meals as i find i tend to crave them so much more when i allow myself to have one so i steer clear. Would you have any objection to this? Theres a few people telling me to add high carb days but i still just dont want to risk it i mide as well give you my stats im 207lbs 5'10 8% b.f i was 230lbs before the diet thing is everything is still working really great and i certanly dont wana mess with something that works so well ill send you my diet and let me know what you think bro
Meal 1-5 eggs
Meal 2- 10ounces of salmon and 4ounces of spinich
meal3-protein shake and 1 tbls of natty pb (3grams carbs a shake)
Meal 4- 10ounces of steak and 4ounces of spinich
Meal 5- Protein shake table spoon pb
Meal 6 2can of tuna
if i get really hungry throughout the day ill throw in another 8 or so ounces of steak

Elite
02-14-08, 6:58 pm
Made a banner for ya from a pic from the philly gathering. Chose this pic as its been my desktop background and inspiration for a better back since i first see it.

http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/1373/mybanner47b4e3c5131ecil4.jpg (http://www.mybannermaker.com/)

Ox
02-18-08, 8:51 pm
ox-
ive been watching the clips of you and guy cisternino train before the nationals on md.com, in the trenches, i wanted to say your delts are insane, i was wondering what your shoulder workout looks like, and do you believe in the pre-exhausting the delts like guy does before pressing?

The last shoulder workout I had I did 6 sets of barbell presses, 3 sets of standing dumbell presses, 3 sets of hammer presses superset with side laterals, and 3 sets of bent over dumbell laterals superset with rear pec deck flys. Sometimes I pre-exhaust and sometimes I press first. There's an occasion for everything.

Ox
02-18-08, 8:53 pm
Hey Ox, quick question man. I'm going to be doing a show the third week of june and the dieting scene for a contest is all new to me. Would the diet you used to prepare for the show be ok for me to try. I'm currently 205lbs wanting to get down around 180 or so. I appreciate any help you can be on this. Thanks man.

You can use the same diet but you will have adjust the fat and protein portions. I have written down the formula at various points throughout this thread and you can figure your macro intake based on your weight.

Ox
02-18-08, 8:54 pm
Tomorrow I will be in Ketosis...
And can i say I lifted today for the first time on whatever was left in my system.
I might already be there since my breath smells kind of weird and my piss has become pale white and makes strange bubbles haha.

All I can say is, I had a great lift today for back and hit all my weight.
I am feeling better I think without carbs than with them.

It may be too early too tell, but I'm doing this for 4 weeks until I go to Florida for 5 days.
After I get back from Florida I will be going back on this ketosis for 4 months.

All I can say is, thanks for everything Ox.
You've been a great help and inspiration for me.

No problem. And the workouts get better and better as you are off the carbs longer. Your pumps improve usually after 3-4 weeks...they get really insane.

Ox
02-18-08, 8:56 pm
Alright awesome.. Thanks a lot man..

One more thing.. I recently decided that I'm gona take a short break from my bulk, and just go on a really quick cut.. Anywhere from 2-4 weeks..

Do you think I should consider giving a keto diet a test drive during this time? Or is it not worth it, being as it's such a short cut.. I'd like to try to it out, just to see how it works out for me, but I'd rather do what will give me better results

You could if you want but personally I don't see the point if your objective is fat loss. If you're doing it to shock your body then it may be worthwhile.

Ox
02-18-08, 9:00 pm
EEA Stack - for sipping between meals (is this necessary?)

The only thing I'm lost on is how I should implement the EFA's and which ones to get, when to take them.

Also, what I should be taking for vascularity... NOX3? Starting 8 weeks out?

[/QUOTE]

You could throw in EAA stack in between meals if you want but if you're on an empty stomach I would opt for Nitro anyday.
Do:
1300 mg evening primrose oil x times daily
1000mg fish oil x 3 times daily
1000mg CLA x 3 times daily

NOX3 is definitely a solid choice.

Ox
02-18-08, 9:07 pm
Hey Ox, its me again, quick question, is Universal's Natural Sterol Complex similar to Stak2? I've read the ingredients and I know they aren't the same, but I'm not as experienced or knowledgeable enough to know exactly what differentiates both of them just by reading their description. What does the Natural Sterol Complex do?

Thanks so much for your time bro, I really appreciate it.

Both products utlize plant based ingredients that support testosterone production. In all honesty, Stak2 is a much more advanced product featuring far more potent anabolic compounds in hefty dosages. Stak2 is a more cutting edge product and is more complete. The natural sterol complex may give you a fuller feel to your muscles and increased protein synthesis but not like Stak.

Pizzalamp
02-18-08, 9:31 pm
hey Evan
In the new issue of Flex, they have a little section on shoulder training with you. You talk about how you superset your delt workout.
Pretty cool!

Ox
02-18-08, 9:38 pm
Ox, got a question, bro.

I'm on keto right now, and I just saw how you have 3 shakes and 3 solid meals a day...I do the same thing, but I'm having trouble with shit I can add to my protein to get the fat content up. I see that you use natural PB, but even just peanuts (with no sugar added) have 5 or 6g of carbs x 3 per day...that's a possible 18g of carbs just from that, plus unless you get a pure whey isolate, there's gonna be about 3g of carbs in the protein, so that's another 9g a day. I try to keep carbs under 20g ED...

Now. My idea was to use heavy cream with my shakes, which I've done before...however, that means that between the cream x3, my last meal (eggs and sausage), and my 8 oz. of beef, a lot of that fat is saturated. I'm not one of those people who obsess over saturated fat at all, in fact I welcome it...that shit's anabolic in my mind, but how bad would it be for such a large portion OF my fats to be saturated vs. say, the unsaturated ones in nuts and oils?

thanks a ton, man.

Use the PB...it's fine. You can't take in that much saturated fat...it's unhealthy and monounsaturated fat is a nice energy source and is heart healthy. Granted, some saturated fat is anabolic and you need it to grow, it has to be balanced with your monos and polys. Sausage? C'mon man get rid of that bullshit.

Ox
02-18-08, 9:43 pm
hey bro ive been dieting for a show which is coming up in a little over 9weeks and ive been hearing a lot about your progress with the ketosis diets and ive been actually using one for the past 6 weeks thing is i dont use any cheat meals as i find i tend to crave them so much more when i allow myself to have one so i steer clear. Would you have any objection to this? Theres a few people telling me to add high carb days but i still just dont want to risk it i mide as well give you my stats im 207lbs 5'10 8% b.f i was 230lbs before the diet thing is everything is still working really great and i certanly dont wana mess with something that works so well ill send you my diet and let me know what you think bro
Meal 1-5 eggs
Meal 2- 10ounces of salmon and 4ounces of spinich
meal3-protein shake and 1 tbls of natty pb (3grams carbs a shake)
Meal 4- 10ounces of steak and 4ounces of spinich
Meal 5- Protein shake table spoon pb
Meal 6 2can of tuna
if i get really hungry throughout the day ill throw in another 8 or so ounces of steak

You must be a big boy because you're eating more than I eat precontest. 6 oz on the meat/fatty fish is plenty. If you're doing a lot of cardio and dieting card then yes you NEED a cheat meal. You haven't been dieting that hard (i don't know what you do for cardio) so that's probably why you don't feel the need for a cheat meal. The purpose of the cheat meal is to prevent your metabolism from shutting down due to the fact that you are in a state of caloric deprivation...you're probably not at that much of a deficit so you're probably not at risk of that. If you drop your portions and are doing a lot of cardio (over an hour per day) then I would say that you need a cheat meal.

Ox
02-18-08, 9:44 pm
Made a banner for ya from a pic from the philly gathering. Chose this pic as its been my desktop background and inspiration for a better back since i first see it.

http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/1373/mybanner47b4e3c5131ecil4.jpg (http://www.mybannermaker.com/)

That's pretty sweet bro...thanks.

ROC1291
02-18-08, 11:03 pm
You must be a big boy because you're eating more than I eat precontest. 6 oz on the meat/fatty fish is plenty. If you're doing a lot of cardio and dieting card then yes you NEED a cheat meal. You haven't been dieting that hard (i don't know what you do for cardio) so that's probably why you don't feel the need for a cheat meal. The purpose of the cheat meal is to prevent your metabolism from shutting down due to the fact that you are in a state of caloric deprivation...you're probably not at that much of a deficit so you're probably not at risk of that. If you drop your portions and are doing a lot of cardio (over an hour per day) then I would say that you need a cheat meal.

Ev, you never know how much protein he could be using in those shakes.
He could have decided to use less protein and fats in shakes and more with whole foods.
I know I adjusted certain meals to use less fats so I could open up room for some extra virgin olive oil to go with my greens for my salmon meal.

ANewBreed
02-19-08, 12:41 am
Evan whats up brother? This is my first day in the Ox's Stable and I REALLLLLY tried looking around the 1200 posts for the information I needed and after 10 pages, I just began to lose track of what I was even looking for. So if I could steal a minute or two of your time I'd appreciate it.


So I decided to jump on the Ketosis bandwagon and did some preliminary research into and I have the basics down. Just wanted to know your thoughts on 1. PWO nutrition, 2. Carbing up

1. I read on here that PWO for you is Animal Nitro followed by Whey Isolate 30 mins after. Do you down just your shake, or do you throw in some fats as well? I know normally the answer would be no, but shit gets all funky on ketosis.

2. What are your policies regarding carb days, or cheat meals? Once a week...once a month...I plan on doing low intensity cardio (walking 3.5 mph level 4 incline), and rather intense work outs.

Oh yeah...just to clarify, the trace carbs from almonds, nuts, and greens are ok? And the whey isolate I have has 1 gram sugar? that ok? I really appreciate it man. Youre an inspiration

Ox
02-19-08, 9:42 am
Ev, you never know how much protein he could be using in those shakes.
He could have decided to use less protein and fats in shakes and more with whole foods.
I know I adjusted certain meals to use less fats so I could open up room for some extra virgin olive oil to go with my greens for my salmon meal.

You should have a steady protein intake throughout the day and the amounts per meal/shake should be the same.

Ox
02-19-08, 9:47 am
Evan whats up brother? This is my first day in the Ox's Stable and I REALLLLLY tried looking around the 1200 posts for the information I needed and after 10 pages, I just began to lose track of what I was even looking for. So if I could steal a minute or two of your time I'd appreciate it.


So I decided to jump on the Ketosis bandwagon and did some preliminary research into and I have the basics down. Just wanted to know your thoughts on 1. PWO nutrition, 2. Carbing up

1. I read on here that PWO for you is Animal Nitro followed by Whey Isolate 30 mins after. Do you down just your shake, or do you throw in some fats as well? I know normally the answer would be no, but shit gets all funky on ketosis.

2. What are your policies regarding carb days, or cheat meals? Once a week...once a month...I plan on doing low intensity cardio (walking 3.5 mph level 4 incline), and rather intense work outs.

Oh yeah...just to clarify, the trace carbs from almonds, nuts, and greens are ok? And the whey isolate I have has 1 gram sugar? that ok? I really appreciate it man. Youre an inspiration


It's okay to have fats in the meal after your workout. When you're dieting, it's just another meal. It's all about giving your body a steady supply of calories/ proteins and fats throughout the day. If it were the offseason and we were trying to gain as much mass as possible etc, then we would have a PWO shake and try to spike insulin and leve out the fats etc etc. When dieting, this isn't necessary. After you've been following the diet for two weeks begin having a cheat MEAL once per week. Have it as the last meal of the day and eat whatever you want (carbs too) within one hour. The trace carbs in nuts and GREEN veggies is okay.

Jburz
02-19-08, 12:03 pm
Ok I have a question. I have been working out since the 7th grade. I have always been able to gain bigger muscles but they aren't as defined as I would like them to be. With that being said. I know you must do the low reps and high weights for definition but I always hear several different answers to exactly how many reps. I have heard 15reps which I think is sort of low to 40reps. What rep amount would you recomend so my muscles have more look then just a big bulge.

jmt92
02-19-08, 5:56 pm
Made a banner for ya from a pic from the philly gathering. Chose this pic as its been my desktop background and inspiration for a better back since i first see it.

http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/1373/mybanner47b4e3c5131ecil4.jpg (http://www.mybannermaker.com/)

hey bro would you mind if I snagged this from you and put it on my myspace?it'd go great with the background I'm about to put up.

Ox I'm so glad you finally got pro I've been waiting for it to happen for a while now.I have a question for you one arms.My family has a pretty X-frame kind of shape to all of them(broad shoulders,thick chest/back,big solid legs,big calves.)but our arms are not so great.I have the vascularity and all,and pretty decent shape, but they are just so small!Their pretty strong I guess, for example I can curl 115 and use 115 for skullcrushers aswell.I thought it was from barely ever doing iso moves for them in the past, but after looking at my dad's I ain't so sure.I read an article by Machine saying that maybe to stop training them for a few eeks would help.What's your opinion on this?Would it be a good idea because I'm looking to do so for the next 3 weeks after this one?Thank's in advance bro and keep repping Animal to the fullest.

-Jmt

ROC1291
02-19-08, 7:13 pm
You should have a steady protein intake throughout the day and the amounts per meal/shake should be the same.

yeah bro i got it down to my science haha.

each meal for me is 40g of protein and about 18g of fat

ROC1291
02-19-08, 7:15 pm
Ok I have a question. I have been working out since the 7th grade. I have always been able to gain bigger muscles but they aren't as defined as I would like them to be. With that being said. I know you must do the low reps and high weights for definition but I always hear several different answers to exactly how many reps. I have heard 15reps which I think is sort of low to 40reps. What rep amount would you recomend so my muscles have more look then just a big bulge.

Ox doesn't have to answer this one for you bro.
Definition comes with conditioning and dieting and you shouldn't be doing 40reps in one set for any training you do.

Reacher34
02-19-08, 7:29 pm
Ox doesn't have to answer this one for you bro.
Definition comes with conditioning and dieting and you shouldn't be doing 40reps in one set for any training you do.

I agree with ROC that definition will come with dieting and "conditioning". Conditioning need not be cardio in the typical sense. It can be from a high intensity and high pace that helps you to burn more calories.

But I definitely disagree with outright discarding 40 rep sets. 40 reps on the leg press or squat will make those wheels grow like no other. And I'm not talking 40 reps with light weight, I'm talking 40 reps with moderately heavy weight that fries your central nervous system and makes you want to shit your pants! I've personally learned so much in my brief 4 years in this sport that I won't rule out anything without first giving it a day in court.

All that being said....Ox is the one with a ripped PRO physique, so lets wait for him to chime in.

Ozkar
02-19-08, 10:45 pm
Alright...first off if you wanna talk nutrition let's say you should shoot for a minimum of six meals per day- 3 whole food meals and 3 shakes. That should be easy if you eat/prepare breakfast and dinner at home and only have to take 3 shakes and 1 meal with you during the day. As for supps I would include (in order of importance) Animal Pak- a good multi, Animal Flex (for your joints), a good protein supplement such as Iso Whey or Animal Max, Fish oil Caps, Evening Primrose Caps, and if you have some extra money buring a hole in your pocket some Torrent. As for training I would train five days a week and be in and out of the gym in under an hour. Hit it hard and go home. DO NOT change your diet from day to day. Always keep it the same.

Hey Ox, got another one bro... If I'm at my job lifting stuff from 9 to 5, and I go to the gym until 6 or 7 pm, do I take Animal Pak at 8 with breakfast? Or do I take it with lunch or my 2nd snack? My concern is regarding whether taking it in the morning will maintain the nutrients in my body throughout the day. If it does, then it'd be better for me, since I am lifting stuff through the day and then going to the gym

Thanks

ROC1291
02-20-08, 3:09 pm
Ox... How do you feel about Animal Max on Keto?

When it comes down to it, mixing 1 scoop of Iso Whey and 1 scoop of Egg pro gives me about 2.5 carbs per shake. If I take 4 scoops of animal max, this will give me the same amount of carbs.

Also, PWO nutrition... Do you use natural peanut butter in your shake or do you just down the whey and not count it as a meal?
I know there might be a chance of the natty pb trace carbs being converted to glycogen pwo.

ANewBreed
02-21-08, 12:23 am
Hey Roc, to help answer your question (I recently asked Ox this earlier), PWO nutrition is just another meal. Consume ur Whey with the fats and just count it as a meal....no details when we're cutting.

Ok now I myself have a question....Im on my second day of Ketosis and Jesus freaking Christ, I can't stop pissing and shitting. I know the diet is supposed to act as a dihuretic (sp?), but Im wondering if it will pass or if its normal...Im pissing a good 2-3 times an hour and Ive taken a crap 3 times already (last two were pure liquid). I am basically following your precontest diet with only a few minor changes.

krazyassmexican
02-21-08, 2:20 pm
Hey Roc, to help answer your question (I recently asked Ox this earlier), PWO nutrition is just another meal. Consume ur Whey with the fats and just count it as a meal....no details when we're cutting.

Ok now I myself have a question....Im on my second day of Ketosis and Jesus freaking Christ, I can't stop pissing and shitting. I know the diet is supposed to act as a dihuretic (sp?), but Im wondering if it will pass or if its normal...Im pissing a good 2-3 times an hour and Ive taken a crap 3 times already (last two were pure liquid). I am basically following your precontest diet with only a few minor changes.

are you eating sodium?
if the answer is no
then add it

yeah it is ok, ox does it
from what he told me when i was dieting the first 2 weeks of ketosis you lose water
then you lose pure fat and nothing but fat

WeeMan
02-21-08, 3:59 pm
hey Ox,
today i got an invitation through the post to compete in this years NABBA Mr Scotland. im not ready for it yet but i think i will do it next year.

it just made me wonder what made you pursue this sport as a career, and how much satisfaction have you gotten from it?

Ox
02-22-08, 9:48 am
Ok I have a question. I have been working out since the 7th grade. I have always been able to gain bigger muscles but they aren't as defined as I would like them to be. With that being said. I know you must do the low reps and high weights for definition but I always hear several different answers to exactly how many reps. I have heard 15reps which I think is sort of low to 40reps. What rep amount would you recomend so my muscles have more look then just a big bulge.

You should stick with 8-12 reps and if you want to see more definition then you should consider cleaning up your diet.

Ox
02-22-08, 9:53 am
hey bro would you mind if I snagged this from you and put it on my myspace?it'd go great with the background I'm about to put up.

Ox I'm so glad you finally got pro I've been waiting for it to happen for a while now.I have a question for you one arms.My family has a pretty X-frame kind of shape to all of them(broad shoulders,thick chest/back,big solid legs,big calves.)but our arms are not so great.I have the vascularity and all,and pretty decent shape, but they are just so small!Their pretty strong I guess, for example I can curl 115 and use 115 for skullcrushers aswell.I thought it was from barely ever doing iso moves for them in the past, but after looking at my dad's I ain't so sure.I read an article by Machine saying that maybe to stop training them for a few eeks would help.What's your opinion on this?Would it be a good idea because I'm looking to do so for the next 3 weeks after this one?Thank's in advance bro and keep repping Animal to the fullest.

-Jmt

Hey man knock yourself out with the banner. The suggestion that machine made may be a great idea for you. I always say that if a bodypart isn;t growing then it's usually because you're training it too much or too little. You just have to find out which one. I would reccomend training arms every other week for 8 weeks or so and see what happends. If they shrink then you know you need to train them more often or use more volume and or intensoty on the one day you do train them. But keep in mind bro, you're only 15 and you've just started growing. They'll get there. Just train them and eat up.

Ox
02-22-08, 9:55 am
Hey Ox, got another one bro... If I'm at my job lifting stuff from 9 to 5, and I go to the gym until 6 or 7 pm, do I take Animal Pak at 8 with breakfast? Or do I take it with lunch or my 2nd snack? My concern is regarding whether taking it in the morning will maintain the nutrients in my body throughout the day. If it does, then it'd be better for me, since I am lifting stuff through the day and then going to the gym

Thanks

If you're going with one pak per day then take it in the afternoon or with lunch. If you're doing a lot of strenuous activity (which it sounds like you are) you can experiment with taking two paks per day (one on the mroning and one in the afternoon).

Ox
02-22-08, 9:57 am
Ox... How do you feel about Animal Max on Keto?

When it comes down to it, mixing 1 scoop of Iso Whey and 1 scoop of Egg pro gives me about 2.5 carbs per shake. If I take 4 scoops of animal max, this will give me the same amount of carbs.

Also, PWO nutrition... Do you use natural peanut butter in your shake or do you just down the whey and not count it as a meal?
I know there might be a chance of the natty pb trace carbs being converted to glycogen pwo.

You can use Animal Max if you want. PWO I have my whey with PB or I just have a whole food meal. Pre-contest it doesn't matter.

Ox
02-22-08, 9:59 am
Hey Roc, to help answer your question (I recently asked Ox this earlier), PWO nutrition is just another meal. Consume ur Whey with the fats and just count it as a meal....no details when we're cutting.

Ok now I myself have a question....Im on my second day of Ketosis and Jesus freaking Christ, I can't stop pissing and shitting. I know the diet is supposed to act as a dihuretic (sp?), but Im wondering if it will pass or if its normal...Im pissing a good 2-3 times an hour and Ive taken a crap 3 times already (last two were pure liquid). I am basically following your precontest diet with only a few minor changes.

That's odd because I've never experienced anything like that. It is possible that you have a bug or a virus and it's coincidence and you're mistaking that for the diet? If not I'm sure it will subside. But if you're following my diet with a few changes then IT IS NOT MY DIET!!!

Ox
02-22-08, 10:11 am
hey Ox,
today i got an invitation through the post to compete in this years NABBA Mr Scotland. im not ready for it yet but i think i will do it next year.

it just made me wonder what made you pursue this sport as a career, and how much satisfaction have you gotten from it?

I didn't choose it, it chose me! Hahaha. Seriously though, it's not like I woke up one morning and said "I wanna be a pro bodybuilder". I've always had aspirations in terms of changing my physique and wanting to look a certain way. Along the way, there were small goals that I set for myself and I reached them. In the process, doing my first show, getting my pro card, and so on were all just the next step in a natural progression. It was where I was headed and it it just made sense to do it. Now that I'm a pro, it's never been my aspiration to be Mr. Olympia. I do however want to make some serious progress this offseason. Maybe next year I'll do really well and over then next few years competitng on the Olympia stage will be the next step in a series of progressions. Maybe it won't. Doesn;t matter. I'm doing what I want to do and if the cards fall into place a result of theat then it was meant to be. I have learned that the more you try to force something, control something, or chase something, the more it will never be. In my opinion, in life, there is the one thing you excell at and there's the one thing that you love. Hopefully they will be the same thing. If you are honest enough with yourself to recognize what those things are and if in fact they are the same thing and you have the balls and the brains to pursue it, then no matter how you cut it, you will come out on top. I seriously believe that some things are meant to be. It's up to you to recognize those things and pursue them in a way that makes sense.

WeeMan
02-22-08, 10:17 am
thanks alot Ox! and best of luck with your career

krazyassmexican
02-22-08, 11:28 am
I didn't choose it, it chose me! Hahaha. Seriously though, it's not like I woke up one morning and said "I wanna be a pro bodybuilder". I've always had aspirations in terms of changing my physique and wanting to look a certain way. Along the way, there were small goals that I set for myself and I reached them. In the process, doing my first show, getting my pro card, and so on were all just the next step in a natural progression. It was where I was headed and it it just made sense to do it. Now that I'm a pro, it's never been my aspiration to be Mr. Olympia. I do however want to make some serious progress this offseason. Maybe next year I'll do really well and over then next few years competitng on the Olympia stage will be the next step in a series of progressions. Maybe it won't. Doesn;t matter. I'm doing what I want to do and if the cards fall into place a result of theat then it was meant to be. I have learned that the more you try to force something, control something, or chase something, the more it will never be. In my opinion, in life, there is the one thing you excell at and there's the one thing that you love. Hopefully they will be the same thing. If you are honest enough with yourself to recognize what those things are and if in fact they are the same thing and you have the balls and the brains to pursue it, then no matter how you cut it, you will come out on top. I seriously believe that some things are meant to be. It's up to you to recognize those things and pursue them in a way that makes sense.

this is the best answer i ever read about being a bodybuilder
i noticed, you, the house and tiny think alike when it comes to the competitive bodybuilder area

ANewBreed
02-22-08, 2:04 pm
That's odd because I've never experienced anything like that. It is possible that you have a bug or a virus and it's coincidence and you're mistaking that for the diet? If not I'm sure it will subside. But if you're following my diet with a few changes then IT IS NOT MY DIET!!!

haha only change was maybe a steak instead of salmon but yeah the whole going to the bathroom thing subsided the following day...Im back to functioning normally. Im guessing it was just such a shock to my body.

mark_Lamb
02-24-08, 10:16 am
You must be a big boy because you're eating more than I eat precontest. 6 oz on the meat/fatty fish is plenty. If you're doing a lot of cardio and dieting card then yes you NEED a cheat meal. You haven't been dieting that hard (i don't know what you do for cardio) so that's probably why you don't feel the need for a cheat meal. The purpose of the cheat meal is to prevent your metabolism from shutting down due to the fact that you are in a state of caloric deprivation...you're probably not at that much of a deficit so you're probably not at risk of that. If you drop your portions and are doing a lot of cardio (over an hour per day) then I would say that you need a cheat meal.


Thanks for the advice bro. I have changed my diet so it know looks something like this:
Meal1: 4eggs 2 eggs whites
Meal2: 2.5 scoops protein powder(containg 50grams protein,3grams carbs) 1tblspoon PB
Meal3: 8ounces of salmon 1/2cup spinich
Meal4: 2.5scoops protein powder (containg 50grams protein,3grams carbs) 1tblspoon PB
Meal5: 6ounces of eye round and 1/2 cup spinich
Meal6: 2can tuna
Let me know what you think bro im currently know at 201lbs 7-8%b.f i do 45minutes of cardio on the stepper right after my first meal then my workout about 4-5hours later and I was 8weeks out from this past saturday. I see that most people who do this type of diet would use 3 shakes where as I am using 2 would you have any ubjection to this? And would there be anything else you would recommend for my diet?

Ox
02-24-08, 12:26 pm
Thanks for the advice bro. I have changed my diet so it know looks something like this:
Meal1: 4eggs 2 eggs whites
Meal2: 2.5 scoops protein powder(containg 50grams protein,3grams carbs) 1tblspoon PB
Meal3: 8ounces of salmon 1/2cup spinich
Meal4: 2.5scoops protein powder (containg 50grams protein,3grams carbs) 1tblspoon PB
Meal5: 6ounces of eye round and 1/2 cup spinich
Meal6: 2can tuna
Let me know what you think bro im currently know at 201lbs 7-8%b.f i do 45minutes of cardio on the stepper right after my first meal then my workout about 4-5hours later and I was 8weeks out from this past saturday. I see that most people who do this type of diet would use 3 shakes where as I am using 2 would you have any ubjection to this? And would there be anything else you would recommend for my diet?


Looks better. Give it a whirl and keep me updated.

bobbymart
02-24-08, 12:44 pm
Hey OX got a question for ya. I know you said you can use spices on you're diet are there any spices at all that yo uwould say are off limits? I know you can't have red peppers but could I use crushed red pepper as a sesoning? Or garlic cloves are another thing i'm curious about I appreciate all of you're help and I'm sorry if this has already been asked I've read most of the 66 pages and have not seen this question yet.

Ox
02-24-08, 6:17 pm
Hey OX got a question for ya. I know you said you can use spices on you're diet are there any spices at all that yo uwould say are off limits? I know you can't have red peppers but could I use crushed red pepper as a sesoning? Or garlic cloves are another thing i'm curious about I appreciate all of you're help and I'm sorry if this has already been asked I've read most of the 66 pages and have not seen this question yet.

Any and all spices are okay so long as they have no calories. Crushed red pepper is okay because it's mainly the seeds. Eating red peppers is different.

ROC1291
02-24-08, 6:31 pm
Any and all spices are okay so long as they have no calories. Crushed red pepper is okay because it's mainly the seeds. Eating red peppers is different.

Sweet Deal...
I just roasted some Cajun Spicy Chicken Breast.

Any of you Keto heads need a new recipe here it goes:

2 tablespoons paprika
2 tablespoons cayenne pepper
1 tablespoon black peppercorns, ground
2 tbsp garlic powder
2 1/2 tbsp onion powder
2 tablespoons dried oregano
Salt

Pound all the ingredients together until you have a powdery consistency and rub all over your chosen meat.

jmt92
02-24-08, 9:14 pm
Hey man knock yourself out with the banner. The suggestion that machine made may be a great idea for you. I always say that if a bodypart isn;t growing then it's usually because you're training it too much or too little. You just have to find out which one. I would reccomend training arms every other week for 8 weeks or so and see what happends. If they shrink then you know you need to train them more often or use more volume and or intensoty on the one day you do train them. But keep in mind bro, you're only 15 and you've just started growing. They'll get there. Just train them and eat up.

Thank's alot bro I'm gonna take a few weeks off of my arms and then start with the 8 weeks off 1 week on deal.


-Jmt

Mizzarler
02-25-08, 2:52 am
Ox, first I just wanna thank you for posting your meal plan and answering all these questions. I'm gonna start a no carb diet in about a week to get down to 5%. But my question is about training. I dont know if someone has already posted this cause i havent read all 60 pages(although i probably should...) But how often do you change your split. Do you keep one split while you cutting and one while your offseason? Right now im chaning it every 2 weeks (2 weeks supersets 5 days lifting 5 days cardio, one week heavy 5 days lifting 3 day cardio, and one week light 4 days lifting 5 days intense cardio)
And also how do you keep your cholesterol in check, I dont know if i could eat 6 whole eggs every morning because my family has had multiple heart attacks... Thanks

born0withno0soul
02-25-08, 2:11 pm
Hi ox, i wanted to know if the new watermelon eaa stack was ok for the keto? it has sucralose and i dont know if thats bad

Ox
02-25-08, 7:00 pm
Ox, first I just wanna thank you for posting your meal plan and answering all these questions. I'm gonna start a no carb diet in about a week to get down to 5%. But my question is about training. I dont know if someone has already posted this cause i havent read all 60 pages(although i probably should...) But how often do you change your split. Do you keep one split while you cutting and one while your offseason? Right now im chaning it every 2 weeks (2 weeks supersets 5 days lifting 5 days cardio, one week heavy 5 days lifting 3 day cardio, and one week light 4 days lifting 5 days intense cardio)
And also how do you keep your cholesterol in check, I dont know if i could eat 6 whole eggs every morning because my family has had multiple heart attacks... Thanks

ALWAYS train the same precontest/dieting as offseason/bulking. As for cholesterol, dietary cholesterol is not what raises your cholesterol levels...refined carbohydrates do. I'm willing to bet that your cholesterol will actually go down! Just make sure you include extra virgin olive oil, macadamia nut oil raw almonds etc as your fat sources. And with your eggs...make sure they are eggs from vegetarian fed hens.

Ox
02-25-08, 7:01 pm
Hi ox, i wanted to know if the new watermelon eaa stack was ok for the keto? it has sucralose and i dont know if thats bad

It's fine.

Lunatic001
02-25-08, 7:08 pm
Ox,

Do you recommend a specific brand/type of Extra Olive oil, mac oil, flaxseed, etc..for the keto diet?

Thanks,
Lunatic001

Pizzalamp
02-25-08, 11:50 pm
Hey Evan,
Hope your training is going great and that your family is well.
Im looking forward to seeing you at the Arnold.

I was wondering, is there a certain type of food or foods that you feel we as humans should avoid at all costs for our general health?

Such as fried foods at restaurants pork rinds krispy kreme cakes etc etc

I never eat fried foods but ive had french fries maybe twice in 3 years

thanks
Grant

SQUAT or DIE!
02-25-08, 11:54 pm
Hey Evan,
Hope your training is going great and that your family is well.
Im looking forward to seeing you at the Arnold.

I was wondering, is there a certain type of food or foods that you feel we as humans should avoid at all costs for our general health?

Such as fried foods at restaurants pork rinds krispy kreme cakes etc etc

I never eat fried foods but ive had french fries maybe twice in 3 years

thanks
Grant

dude kracklin is amazing, fried pork skin, fat and some meat!!!!!! MMMM soo bad for you!

Ox
02-26-08, 9:19 am
Hey Evan,
Hope your training is going great and that your family is well.
Im looking forward to seeing you at the Arnold.

I was wondering, is there a certain type of food or foods that you feel we as humans should avoid at all costs for our general health?

Such as fried foods at restaurants pork rinds krispy kreme cakes etc etc

I never eat fried foods but ive had french fries maybe twice in 3 years

thanks
Grant

For overall health I don't feel it's important to avoid fats, proteins, carbs, cholesterol, saturated fat etc etc. I do think it's important to avoid ANYTHING THAT IS PROCESSED. I have to laugh when I hear about people eating tofu dogs or soy burger patties and shit like that. They'll say "but it only has x amount of fat and x # of calories" Woopdy fuckin do. I'd rather eat a fatty porterhouse steak than that shit. You've gotta undersatnd one thing...We've evolved over thousands of years to eat certain types of food. It is my assumption that your body is much better evolved to eat a fatty piece of meat than it is to eat a tofu dog. Your body doesn't know what the fuck to do with that! I wish people would just stop with the bullshit. Your meant to eat the shit that people have been eating for thousands of years. Hydrogenated fats, processed grains, flour, high fructose corn syrup etc etc is not on that list. Keep it simple. I don't give a shit how much cholesterol, carbs, saturated fat etc is in something I'm eating so long as it is found that way in nature.

krazyassmexican
02-26-08, 9:22 am
For overall health I don't feel it's important to avoid fats, proteins, carbs, cholesterol, saturated fat etc etc. I do think it's important to avoid ANYTHING THAT IS PROCESSED. I have to laugh when I hear about people eating tofu dogs or soy burger patties and shit like that. They'll say "but it only has x amount of fat and x # of calories" Woopdy fuckin do. I'd rather eat a fatty porterhouse steak than that shit. You've gotta undersatnd one thing...We've evolved over thousands of years to eat certain types of food. It is my assumption that your body is much better evolved to eat a fatty piece of meat than it is to eat a tofu dog. Your body doesn't know what the fuck to do with that! I wish people would just stop with the bullshit. Your meant to eat the shit that people have been eating for thousands of years. Hydrogenated fats, processed grains, flour, high fructose corn syrup etc etc is not on that list. Keep it simple. I don't give a shit how much cholesterol, carbs, saturated fat etc is in something I'm eating so long as it is found that way in nature.

what do you think of frozen meats?
are they bad?

houseofpain
02-26-08, 9:24 am
For overall health I don't feel it's important to avoid fats, proteins, carbs, cholesterol, saturated fat etc etc. I do think it's important to avoid ANYTHING THAT IS PROCESSED. I have to laugh when I hear about people eating tofu dogs or soy burger patties and shit like that. They'll say "but it only has x amount of fat and x # of calories" Woopdy fuckin do. I'd rather eat a fatty porterhouse steak than that shit. You've gotta undersatnd one thing...We've evolved over thousands of years to eat certain types of food. It is my assumption that your body is much better evolved to eat a fatty piece of meat than it is to eat a tofu dog. Your body doesn't know what the fuck to do with that! I wish people would just stop with the bullshit. Your meant to eat the shit that people have been eating for thousands of years. Hydrogenated fats, processed grains, flour, high fructose corn syrup etc etc is not on that list. Keep it simple. I don't give a shit how much cholesterol, carbs, saturated fat etc is in something I'm eating so long as it is found that way in nature.

x2. my dads a vegetarian but he thinks its ok to eat soy burgers and tofu dogs. he still eats fish. he avoids his definition of "processed foods". I try telling him that that shit isn't any better for you because it's so unbelievably processed and your body doesn't know what to do with it. he's a runner and is paranoid that if he eats a slice of pepperoni the world might end.

Pizzalamp
02-26-08, 10:33 am
For overall health I don't feel it's important to avoid fats, proteins, carbs, cholesterol, saturated fat etc etc. I do think it's important to avoid ANYTHING THAT IS PROCESSED. I have to laugh when I hear about people eating tofu dogs or soy burger patties and shit like that. They'll say "but it only has x amount of fat and x # of calories" Woopdy fuckin do. I'd rather eat a fatty porterhouse steak than that shit. You've gotta undersatnd one thing...We've evolved over thousands of years to eat certain types of food. It is my assumption that your body is much better evolved to eat a fatty piece of meat than it is to eat a tofu dog. Your body doesn't know what the fuck to do with that! I wish people would just stop with the bullshit. Your meant to eat the shit that people have been eating for thousands of years. Hydrogenated fats, processed grains, flour, high fructose corn syrup etc etc is not on that list. Keep it simple. I don't give a shit how much cholesterol, carbs, saturated fat etc is in something I'm eating so long as it is found that way in nature.

thanks evan

ROC1291
02-26-08, 10:34 pm
Ox, I don't want it to seem like I have to run to you every time I need an answer for these thoughts running through my mind, but you've been a great help so far. Truth is, I've started Keto and I've been doing excellent on it lately, I mean EXCELLENT. However, I am on my school's baseball team and it's starting to interfere with my personal goals. The calories I put out during practice and the 10/15 minutes of conditioning we do is really messing my diet up. By the time I get to the gym, I have barely any caloric energy leftover. I want to stay on Keto, I absolutely love my energy from it. What can I do to maintain my energy while playing baseball and training (Low Intensity Cardio and Lifting) without really shitting up my muscle mass and still having great energy to workout?

I'll give you my meal plan thus far...

Meal 1: 6 Egglands Best
Meal 2: 40g Whey, 2TBS NPB
Meal 3: 7 oz. Chicken, 2 Cups Green Salad, 1/3 Cup Almonds
Meal 4: Same as 2
Meal 5: 6 oz Salmon, Asparagus, 1 TSP EVOO
Meal 6: Same as 2+4

Latimer316
02-27-08, 8:39 am
Hey bro, I know you got a lot of questions to answer so I understand if it takes some time. I've been getting a lot of input and reading a lot on your thread as far as the keto diet goes. As of next monday im 15 weeks out from my first show and currently my weight is 208 with 15%bf. I want to get down to 175 to compete. As far as the diet goes when do carbs come into play with the diet? I've seen different answers and different times of the cut. Any help would be much appreciated. Thank you

mark_Lamb
02-28-08, 4:15 pm
Looks better. Give it a whirl and keep me updated.

Hey Evan I was wondering what does your diet look like when your getting close to show time? Do you start to progressivly lower calories or do you stay the same right threw? I know you probably posted all this stuff already so I apologize if your repeating yourself.

mustgetbig
02-28-08, 4:28 pm
Hey Evan I was wondering what does your diet look like when your getting close to show time? Do you start to progressivly lower calories or do you stay the same right threw? I know you probably posted all this stuff already so I apologize if your repeating yourself.

here ya go bro
http://forum.animalpak.com/showthread.php?t=13525

mark_Lamb
02-28-08, 5:58 pm
Thanks bro

mustgetbig
02-28-08, 6:52 pm
Thanks bro

just doin my part

Seifer
02-29-08, 4:21 pm
Hey Evan, I'm 2 weeks into my keto diet, following it by the letter, counting up all the fat/protein/carb %'s, etc. Doing 3 days on, 1 day off split. 30min of cardio a day. I'm also getting 8-9 hours of solid sleep every single night. I've cut back on my suppliments. Limited now to Pack, Universal Natural Sterol, fish oils, and Beta Alanine. (cut of Pump because I felt like it was doing less and less for me, but I'll be back to it in a few weeks)

I'm 185lb, shooting for low 170s at the end of 10 more weeks for my first show.



My question is about my heartrate. Sometimes, even while I'm at work or at home, it seems to be beating faster than it should. Today I got on the treadmill and my HR was almost 120bpm! This was 15 seconds after starting. I wasnt tired, or jittery (no caffiene). I felt great in fact.


This happens to me only while on a ketogenic diet. When I'm consuming carbs it doesnt happen. Is this normal?

Brew
02-29-08, 4:43 pm
I was on your official website looking at your pics by Per Bernal and i couldnt help but notice that your triceps are amazing. As i have been struggling with my own arm development i have to ask, how do you hit your tri's, reps sets lifts ect..

Brew

born0withno0soul
03-02-08, 11:58 pm
hey ox, i want to know your thoughts on training the days before a contest. do you rest and recover, do light workouts, or keep busting ass up to the show? i was curious about this because i would think if you quit lifting two to three days before the show while adding carbs to the keto you should really fill out. just a thought so yours would be greatly appreciated

Ozkar
03-03-08, 9:13 pm
Hey Ox, got another one for you bro.

I took your advice and I'm taking the supps you told me (for my weak joints) and I've been doing great, although I've encountered a problem that I've had many times before. Whenever I'm doing a Pulling Exercise, my wrists give in way longer than the actual muscle I'm training. I have never tried using lifting straps, but was wondering whether they would make a difference. Are they useful for all kinds of exercises, or just for the pulling ones? Cause I've tried and pictured in my head how they work, and I can't imagine them working for sth like a bench press...

Now, other than using lifting straps, is there anything else I can do about this? Usually all my joints will hurt, but right now what is keeping me down the most is my left wrist and my lower back.

Thanks

Joseb
03-03-08, 10:06 pm
During keto, should you use the regular 2 grams of protein per pound LBM or the recommended 1 gram of protein per pound LBM? I'm assuming the 1g is for regular people who just want to lose weight instead of bodybuilders who want to retain as much muscle as we can.

scals
03-04-08, 12:30 am
Hey Ox,

I don't mean to be a jackass and further bother you at your diet, but I need some help. I'm gonna start cutting this upcoming monday, 28 weeks out from my show. I'm 240 looking to get down to around 200ish. It just seems to be a long period of time to have no carbs. I wanna make sure to do this the right way, so any input you have I would really appreciate it. Sorry again to be a pain in the ass.

Scals

youngun
03-04-08, 12:32 am
Hey, bro. Hope your life and training is going well. I asked this question of Big Ant, but have not heard back from him. Would you mind helping a fellow builder out?

First off, I'm 24 and on HRT. With therapy, total T at ~1100 ng/dL now. Estradiol too high at 51. (Looking to take care of e2 with an AI to bring it back to mid-range). No need to comment on this. Just FYI.

Basically, I am looking for an evaluation of my regimen, eating, and supplementation.

Height: 5'11"
Weight: 227 lbs.
Body fat: < 10% (my guess from previous measurements: 7%)
Goal: muscle size (fuller, denser, harder, bigger)

Lifting Sched:
- Sun, Tue, Thu: back (4 exer.), chest (3 exer.), legs (2 exer; I have proportionately big legs).
- Mon, Wed, Fri: calves (2 ex.), biceps (3 ex.), triceps (3 ex), shoulders (3-4 ex).
- Exercises: mostly compound, mass-building exercises with heavy weights. E.g., bench, pull-ups, t-bar corner row, dbell row, squats, deadlifts, etc.
- I constantly vary exercises.
- Mostly 5 sets of 5 reps for strength, some size.
- I consider myself a "powerbuilder": I sort of implement powerlifting moves in order to grow. It's been working, but I have been feeling stagnant lately.
- I could get specific on exercises if you'd like.

So far, it's been good. However, wondering if it's too much volume, too low of reps, other. I recover quickly due to good nutrition and HRT. Wondering if I could do better with less volume, though.

Nutrition:
- Eat every 2-3 hours
- ~40% carbs, 30% fat, 30% protein daily.
- Mostly protein (tuna, chicken, beef, eggs), fat (olive oil, walnuts, etc.), and veggies at all times before a workout. (Carbs only after a workout except for fruit.)
- Non-workout days: no starchy/refined carbs (usually, unless I'm feeling "flat")
- 20g BCAA + 5g creatine during a workout.
- Huge hit of quality carbs (recovery drink, oats, wheat, fruit, etc.) and protein for ~6 hours after (3 feedings). Some call this "nutrient timing." (Learned from Dr. John Berardi.)
- Wondering if my muscles need more carbs around the clock to grow.

Thanks for your time, bro! Cheers!

herdz
03-04-08, 3:47 pm
Hey OX,

It was great meeting you this weekend man. I really learned alot from you and the other guys. I was wondering when I should start the Kito diet and if you have any main rules or tips to follow. I'm currently 14weeks out from the FAME Worlds, I'm competing in the Junior BB devision. Any info would be great. Thanks man!!!

Herdz

bigbull52
03-04-08, 4:27 pm
Hey man...

I came up to you at the cage and we talked about the ketogenic diet for a while...Thanks for your input and help with everything.... You made me realize your just a guy and I mean that as a total compliment... You look fuckin great... Just curious on what body parts you think you gotta bring up for the New York?? Either this year or next...what is your main focus?? I remember hearing Flex Wheeler saying your chest was a little thin?? What'da think about that?? Agree Disagree?? Anyway thanks for being cool as fuck... Good luck with everything..Bull

Beast4Life
03-04-08, 6:05 pm
Hey, Evan. What's up man? I was wondering what exercises you think are best for building a great back. Would you say all you really need for width and density is pullups/pulldowns, deadlifts, and t-bar rows, or would you advise more exercises?

Ozkar
03-05-08, 11:24 am
Hi Ox... I know that you've been asked these questions before, so if you don't feel like answering them again I'd understand and appreciate itf you could instead post a link that could help me.

I've been reading a lot of questions about the Keto diet... I have a basic understanding of it but would really appreciate if you could tell me exactly what it is about and if it is only recommended for cutting.

Also, I'd like to know... how does your diet and training differ when you're bulking and when you're cutting? Do you change them a lot? Or do you just change the supps (perhaps adding Cuts only) and add cardio?

If you could please tell me what you're diet and training looks like regularly or post the link I would be truly grateful.

Thanks for all of your time, patience and answers bro.

bovat
03-05-08, 3:26 pm
so im thinking about trying this type of diet. My protein is 330 grams a day, so that would mean i need like 140 g of fat a day. Im thinkin of eatin four eggs in the morning, and some peanut butter in the morning with a shake, and right before bed, and then eatin like a cup of almonds a day. That should be about it, and some salad dressing with my salad at lunch. Unless im eatin like red meant or fish, then i will lower my almond intake. Does this sound okay. Am i gettin a good variety of fat. And waht are essential carbs, the only carbs i would really be gettin would be like salad at lunch, and maybe some vegetable later on, like brocoli or greenbeans or peas. Any advice on stuff to ad, or anything really

Ox
03-05-08, 11:20 pm
Hey bro, I know you got a lot of questions to answer so I understand if it takes some time. I've been getting a lot of input and reading a lot on your thread as far as the keto diet goes. As of next monday im 15 weeks out from my first show and currently my weight is 208 with 15%bf. I want to get down to 175 to compete. As far as the diet goes when do carbs come into play with the diet? I've seen different answers and different times of the cut. Any help would be much appreciated. Thank you

I usually drop mine 15 weeks before my show. And I diet pretty hard and don't get TOO fat in the offseason. I suggest you drop em now.

Ox
03-05-08, 11:22 pm
Hey Evan, I'm 2 weeks into my keto diet, following it by the letter, counting up all the fat/protein/carb %'s, etc. Doing 3 days on, 1 day off split. 30min of cardio a day. I'm also getting 8-9 hours of solid sleep every single night. I've cut back on my suppliments. Limited now to Pack, Universal Natural Sterol, fish oils, and Beta Alanine. (cut of Pump because I felt like it was doing less and less for me, but I'll be back to it in a few weeks)

I'm 185lb, shooting for low 170s at the end of 10 more weeks for my first show.



My question is about my heartrate. Sometimes, even while I'm at work or at home, it seems to be beating faster than it should. Today I got on the treadmill and my HR was almost 120bpm! This was 15 seconds after starting. I wasnt tired, or jittery (no caffiene). I felt great in fact.


This happens to me only while on a ketogenic diet. When I'm consuming carbs it doesnt happen. Is this normal?

I don't know. I've never heard of this. But as long as your heart rate stays between 120 and 130 while you're doing your cardio you're fine.

Ox
03-05-08, 11:23 pm
hey ox, i want to know your thoughts on training the days before a contest. do you rest and recover, do light workouts, or keep busting ass up to the show? i was curious about this because i would think if you quit lifting two to three days before the show while adding carbs to the keto you should really fill out. just a thought so yours would be greatly appreciated

If my show is on Friday I would make tuesday my last day with weights and take wednesday, thurs, and friday to carb up

Ox
03-05-08, 11:26 pm
Hey Ox, got another one for you bro.

I took your advice and I'm taking the supps you told me (for my weak joints) and I've been doing great, although I've encountered a problem that I've had many times before. Whenever I'm doing a Pulling Exercise, my wrists give in way longer than the actual muscle I'm training. I have never tried using lifting straps, but was wondering whether they would make a difference. Are they useful for all kinds of exercises, or just for the pulling ones? Cause I've tried and pictured in my head how they work, and I can't imagine them working for sth like a bench press...

Now, other than using lifting straps, is there anything else I can do about this? Usually all my joints will hurt, but right now what is keeping me down the most is my left wrist and my lower back.

Thanks

I started using straps on back day after Dave Palumbo suggested it to me in 2006 and since then I've seen a big difference in my back development. Straps are a great tool. It's pretty much a given that your grip will give before your back so if you use straps then you should get a lot more out of your pulling movements.

Ox
03-05-08, 11:26 pm
During keto, should you use the regular 2 grams of protein per pound LBM or the recommended 1 gram of protein per pound LBM? I'm assuming the 1g is for regular people who just want to lose weight instead of bodybuilders who want to retain as much muscle as we can.

I do 1.5. 2 is too much for me.

Ox
03-05-08, 11:28 pm
Hey Ox,

I don't mean to be a jackass and further bother you at your diet, but I need some help. I'm gonna start cutting this upcoming monday, 28 weeks out from my show. I'm 240 looking to get down to around 200ish. It just seems to be a long period of time to have no carbs. I wanna make sure to do this the right way, so any input you have I would really appreciate it. Sorry again to be a pain in the ass.

Scals

I don't think 28 weeks with zero carbs is a good idea. What makes you think you need 28 weeks of dieting?

Ox
03-05-08, 11:31 pm
Hey, bro. Hope your life and training is going well. I asked this question of Big Ant, but have not heard back from him. Would you mind helping a fellow builder out?

First off, I'm 24 and on HRT. With therapy, total T at ~1100 ng/dL now. Estradiol too high at 51. (Looking to take care of e2 with an AI to bring it back to mid-range). No need to comment on this. Just FYI.

Basically, I am looking for an evaluation of my regimen, eating, and supplementation.

Height: 5'11"
Weight: 227 lbs.
Body fat: < 10% (my guess from previous measurements: 7%)
Goal: muscle size (fuller, denser, harder, bigger)

Lifting Sched:
- Sun, Tue, Thu: back (4 exer.), chest (3 exer.), legs (2 exer; I have proportionately big legs).
- Mon, Wed, Fri: calves (2 ex.), biceps (3 ex.), triceps (3 ex), shoulders (3-4 ex).
- Exercises: mostly compound, mass-building exercises with heavy weights. E.g., bench, pull-ups, t-bar corner row, dbell row, squats, deadlifts, etc.
- I constantly vary exercises.
- Mostly 5 sets of 5 reps for strength, some size.
- I consider myself a "powerbuilder": I sort of implement powerlifting moves in order to grow. It's been working, but I have been feeling stagnant lately.
- I could get specific on exercises if you'd like.

So far, it's been good. However, wondering if it's too much volume, too low of reps, other. I recover quickly due to good nutrition and HRT. Wondering if I could do better with less volume, though.

Nutrition:
- Eat every 2-3 hours
- ~40% carbs, 30% fat, 30% protein daily.
- Mostly protein (tuna, chicken, beef, eggs), fat (olive oil, walnuts, etc.), and veggies at all times before a workout. (Carbs only after a workout except for fruit.)
- Non-workout days: no starchy/refined carbs (usually, unless I'm feeling "flat")
- 20g BCAA + 5g creatine during a workout.
- Huge hit of quality carbs (recovery drink, oats, wheat, fruit, etc.) and protein for ~6 hours after (3 feedings). Some call this "nutrient timing." (Learned from Dr. John Berardi.)
- Wondering if my muscles need more carbs around the clock to grow.

Thanks for your time, bro! Cheers!


Your diet looks cool but I think your training is off. I don;t knwo anything about "powerbuilding" but the regimine your following is not (in my opinion) conducive to bodybuilding. I would stick to training one MAIN bodypart per day and doing 4-5 different excercises and 3-4 sets of each and upping the reps to at least 8.

Ox
03-05-08, 11:32 pm
Hey OX,

It was great meeting you this weekend man. I really learned alot from you and the other guys. I was wondering when I should start the Kito diet and if you have any main rules or tips to follow. I'm currently 14weeks out from the FAME Worlds, I'm competing in the Junior BB devision. Any info would be great. Thanks man!!!

Herdz

Depends on how lean you are/how easy or hard it is for you to get in shape. I usually do 15 or 16 weeks but I'm also considerably heavier than you. It depends on you.

Ox
03-05-08, 11:34 pm
Hey man...

I came up to you at the cage and we talked about the ketogenic diet for a while...Thanks for your input and help with everything.... You made me realize your just a guy and I mean that as a total compliment... You look fuckin great... Just curious on what body parts you think you gotta bring up for the New York?? Either this year or next...what is your main focus?? I remember hearing Flex Wheeler saying your chest was a little thin?? What'da think about that?? Agree Disagree?? Anyway thanks for being cool as fuck... Good luck with everything..Bull

I definitely need to work on my chest..it's always been a tough part for me. My legs still need to be bigger and after chilling out on my arms and delts last year I'm ready to get them big and freaky. Basically, I think everything needs work! Nice meetin' you too bro.

Ox
03-05-08, 11:35 pm
Hey, Evan. What's up man? I was wondering what exercises you think are best for building a great back. Would you say all you really need for width and density is pullups/pulldowns, deadlifts, and t-bar rows, or would you advise more exercises?

Deadlifts for thickness. Barbell rows for width and thickness. Everything else is just icing on the cake.

kyderz
03-05-08, 11:53 pm
Yo Ev.

I recently started using deadlifts in my back workouts [I know, should've been doing them all along]. I don't do a 'power' type of deadlift, so to speak. It is almost a mix between a SLDL and a regular dead. The reason for this is to focus on my back more than my legs. Do you agree with this?

The explanation is:

I grab the weight from outside of the squat rack, step back 2 or 3 steps and perform the exercise as I explained above - between a SLDL and conventional [closer to SLDL though].

I feel this more in my back than ANYTHING else, even regular deads.

Is this legit or am I wasting my time?

By the way, I am using 225 for 8+ reps.

MedusaThrills
03-06-08, 5:11 am
Hey Ox, I havent spoken to you before, but have heard great stories :)

Firstly, I am looking to compete next summer (ill be 17 then). What advice would you give to someone getting ready and hopefully rank high, in their first show? How old were you when you first competed and what place did you come?

Secondly, How are you approached by society? How do people react to you when you are walking down aisle 5 in walmart or whatever?

Lastly, How would i go about getting an ex-bodybuilder to train me? Would i have to check out local hardcore gyms and talk to people or what not?

Many thanks in advance,

Alex

herdz
03-06-08, 8:37 am
Depends on how lean you are/how easy or hard it is for you to get in shape. I usually do 15 or 16 weeks but I'm also considerably heavier than you. It depends on you.



Ox,
I'm sitting at 183lbs and I;m guessing about 7 or so % BF. 13 weeks out this sat. THis is my third time competing so its getting easier each time. What do you think abou tth eketo diet, when do i start and what do i need to do?
Herdz

Ox
03-06-08, 10:09 am
Yo Ev.

I recently started using deadlifts in my back workouts [I know, should've been doing them all along]. I don't do a 'power' type of deadlift, so to speak. It is almost a mix between a SLDL and a regular dead. The reason for this is to focus on my back more than my legs. Do you agree with this?

The explanation is:

I grab the weight from outside of the squat rack, step back 2 or 3 steps and perform the exercise as I explained above - between a SLDL and conventional [closer to SLDL though].

I feel this more in my back than ANYTHING else, even regular deads.

Is this legit or am I wasting my time?

By the way, I am using 225 for 8+ reps.

Nah man you're not wasting your time. To tell you the truth, that's how I usually do em. If you feel it where you want to feel it, how can it be wrong? It can't. Keep doin your thing.

Wasteland
03-06-08, 10:11 am
Hey Ox, I understand you're a fan of EFAs. For you, how do EFAs fit in with your supplement programs? Thanks.

Ox
03-06-08, 10:18 am
Hey Ox, I havent spoken to you before, but have heard great stories :)

Firstly, I am looking to compete next summer (ill be 17 then). What advice would you give to someone getting ready and hopefully rank high, in their first show? How old were you when you first competed and what place did you come?

Secondly, How are you approached by society? How do people react to you when you are walking down aisle 5 in walmart or whatever?

Lastly, How would i go about getting an ex-bodybuilder to train me? Would i have to check out local hardcore gyms and talk to people or what not?

Many thanks in advance,

Alex

The best advice I could give is DO NOT RUSH! TAKE YOUR TIME. In my opinion, far too many people compete before they are ready. I did my first show when I was 23. I won the heavyweight and overall. But you gotta keep in mind, I had a solid 7 or so years of training under my belt by then and had been seriously bodybuilding for 3 of those years. I was encouraged to compete when I was a teen but I made the decision to wait. I had an idea i my head of how I wanted to look/what I wanted to be when I got onstage. I never wanted to compete just for then sake of competing; I still don't. I go on stage only once I know I will bring a package that will be better than what I've displayed in the past. I've never gone into a show just hoping to place. I always wanted to be my personal best because I knew that if I could do that then I would win no matter what.
With the exception of the last week and my water manipulation I trained myself and dieted myself for my first show. I seriously believe that the whole thing is a learning experience and it is something that you need to figure out for yourself. In my opinion, being a good bodybuilder means mastering your body and knowing yourself inside and out.

Ox
03-06-08, 10:20 am
Ox,
I'm sitting at 183lbs and I;m guessing about 7 or so % BF. 13 weeks out this sat. THis is my third time competing so its getting easier each time. What do you think abou tth eketo diet, when do i start and what do i need to do?
Herdz

What do you mean when you ask me what I think about it? You have to make the decision as to when you think you should start it. If this is your third show then you should know how much time you need to get ready. If you decide to do it, it is discussed extensively throughout this thread. Look back and all the info you need is there.

Beast4Life
03-06-08, 10:48 am
Deadlifts for thickness. Barbell rows for width and thickness. Everything else is just icing on the cake.

Thanks Ox! Ill work on those lifts.

herdz
03-06-08, 12:26 pm
Ight Thanks man

Herdz

born0withno0soul
03-06-08, 1:17 pm
so ox how do you figure on how much to carb up days before the show?

stumblin54
03-06-08, 1:57 pm
Lookin' good on the April MD Ox.

Stumblin

scals
03-06-08, 2:14 pm
I don't think 28 weeks with zero carbs is a good idea. What makes you think you need 28 weeks of dieting?

I have never done a cut for a show before so I want to make sure that I gave it ample time. I have no problem gaining weight but losing weight is another story. I dont wanna say that I if I prepared longer that I would be been better. I wanna make sure that my diet is the best that it can be, and with the length of the diet I can tweak it if the results are not coming the way that I would like them to. If you have any suggestions on when to possibly apply the keto diet to my contest prep I would really appreciate it. Thanks.

HoldFast
03-06-08, 5:41 pm
Ox,

In a few weeks I am going to start up on a Keto Diet. I have a lot of protein powder laying around from buying in bulk!
Only problem is this protein gives 3g of carbs per serving. Would drinking two shakes ( 6grams x 2 a day ) be too much to stay in ketosis. Reason being, If I do not have to go out and get new lower carb protein I won't, but if I do I will...

Thanks in advance.

Bad.Man.56
03-06-08, 7:27 pm
Hey Evan,

Just wanted to start off by thanking you for this wealth of knowledge you've outlined. I've read through all of it, and it is great. I want to wish you the best of luck in your career and all of your upcoming shows. Its great to see a fellow italian in the pro circuit.

I had a few assorted questions, that I haven't been able to figure out, I would love to get your perspective.

1) What do you do when you're sick during the season, and feel like you're going to pass out sitting still, let alone if you went in to train. Do you let the diet slide a little and skip the gym to attempt to recuperate? Or do you hit the gym in an attempt to kick the colds ass

2) I am heading home for the weekend, and will have access to a Trader Joe's (can't find one in Vegas), I was wondering if you could pass along your shopping list from Trader Joe's, as far as the Natty PB, Fish Oil, and just any other foods I would need to get. I have all of my protein powders, Uni-liver, pak, and BCAA's in line, now its time for the food. I'll be starting the Keto diet monday, and really am looking forward to it.

I'd just like to thank you once again for your great willingness to help a fellow lifter out, and wish you nothing but the best in your career. I hope I can catch a show someday soon!

Vinny G
03-07-08, 8:18 am
Evan....training at Strong and Shapley gym at the ABC on March 22nd?

A lot of guys are PMing me, asking if your going to show up.....whats the deal dude.

ChandlerXJ
03-07-08, 10:42 am
Evan! How's are things man? I started the diet last week, and let me tell you bro, I feel awesome... I took the first two days of the diet off from training so I could catch up on some school work, and quite honestly, I didn't feel like shit at all - by the time I hit my first day of training, it was nuts! My strength was better, I looked full, and I just felt "clear" to put a word to it.

Anyways, I know you're a huge advocate of stiff-legged deads for your hamstring development, do you mind talking about your technique and form? I've been doing these lately and I feel like I'm not nailing it right on... Also, I'm doing everything raw, I've always been between straps - but I read that you encourage them, so maybe I'll work them into the heavier sets to try to get a few more reps. I've personally just always been proud of my grip strength.

Keep hitting it hard Evan, I'll keep you posted on my dieting progress in a few weeks...

Thanks for all the help and support man - you're like the guidance counselor we all wished we had growing up! haha

LittleMan55
03-08-08, 10:08 am
Hey Ox,

I know its coming a little late, but I wanted to thank you for signing my MD at the Cage last weekend. Keep up all the good work. Can't wait to see what you have in store for us the next time your on stage.

Broc

bigbull52
03-08-08, 2:52 pm
Hey ox.... how long do you cut the fats out of your diet completely...Like when your just eating your fish/chicken/veggies?? Not eggs or nuts or anything?? And if your pre-judging is around like noon what time do u eat breakfast?

Ozkar
03-09-08, 8:36 pm
Hey Ox

I was just at your site and went through your whole bio section, and I just have to say that I know how it feels when you're a kid and you're the biggest one in your classroom, and at the soccer team... and at the pool parties... So I just wanted to congratulate you on overcoming all of that and becoming a succesful bodybuilder and thank you for the motivation that this represents. I have to admit that it is still difficult for me to take off my shirt sometimes cause I'm nowhere near where I want to be, but I've improved over the years.

Also, I posted a question for you regarding your diet, supps and training and already found the answer to your diet by reading the article you wrote "Zero Carb Method" and I think I read somewhere that your training really doesn't change that much from bulking to cutting, did I imagine this or am I on the right path?

Anyway, thanks for all of your input, dedication, motivation and the time you invest in helping us all out by answering our endless questions.

Really appreciate it bro.

Ox
03-10-08, 7:30 pm
Ox,

In a few weeks I am going to start up on a Keto Diet. I have a lot of protein powder laying around from buying in bulk!
Only problem is this protein gives 3g of carbs per serving. Would drinking two shakes ( 6grams x 2 a day ) be too much to stay in ketosis. Reason being, If I do not have to go out and get new lower carb protein I won't, but if I do I will...

Thanks in advance.

I would look for something else.

Ox
03-10-08, 7:37 pm
Hey Evan,

Just wanted to start off by thanking you for this wealth of knowledge you've outlined. I've read through all of it, and it is great. I want to wish you the best of luck in your career and all of your upcoming shows. Its great to see a fellow italian in the pro circuit.

I had a few assorted questions, that I haven't been able to figure out, I would love to get your perspective.

1) What do you do when you're sick during the season, and feel like you're going to pass out sitting still, let alone if you went in to train. Do you let the diet slide a little and skip the gym to attempt to recuperate? Or do you hit the gym in an attempt to kick the colds ass

2) I am heading home for the weekend, and will have access to a Trader Joe's (can't find one in Vegas), I was wondering if you could pass along your shopping list from Trader Joe's, as far as the Natty PB, Fish Oil, and just any other foods I would need to get. I have all of my protein powders, Uni-liver, pak, and BCAA's in line, now its time for the food. I'll be starting the Keto diet monday, and really am looking forward to it.

I'd just like to thank you once again for your great willingness to help a fellow lifter out, and wish you nothing but the best in your career. I hope I can catch a show someday soon!

Thank YOU...it's my pleaure to be here.

1) The key is not to GET sick! If you get sufficient sleep, employ solid nutrition, and avoid as much stress as possible you should never be sick...I couldn't tell you the last time I was sick. But I guess that if I was, I might push through my workout but make sure I get a lot of sleep. As for the diet, there's never a good enough reason to just eat crap. If you're vomiting and can't keep food down then obviously don't eat. Otherwise, the better your diet is, the sooner you will get better.

2) Here's what I get from Trader Joe's when on Keto:
Organic Extra Virgin Olive Oil (Only the Italian stuff)
Organic All Natural Chunky Peanut Butter
Raw Almonds
Raw Cashews
Organic Cage free Omega-3 Eggs

Hope this helps. Peace.

Ox
03-10-08, 7:37 pm
Evan....training at Strong and Shapley gym at the ABC on March 22nd?

A lot of guys are PMing me, asking if your going to show up.....whats the deal dude.

Not sure yet. I'll let you know.

Vinny G
03-10-08, 7:42 pm
Not sure yet. I'll let you know.

OK cool

Ox
03-10-08, 7:43 pm
Evan! How's are things man? I started the diet last week, and let me tell you bro, I feel awesome... I took the first two days of the diet off from training so I could catch up on some school work, and quite honestly, I didn't feel like shit at all - by the time I hit my first day of training, it was nuts! My strength was better, I looked full, and I just felt "clear" to put a word to it.

Anyways, I know you're a huge advocate of stiff-legged deads for your hamstring development, do you mind talking about your technique and form? I've been doing these lately and I feel like I'm not nailing it right on... Also, I'm doing everything raw, I've always been between straps - but I read that you encourage them, so maybe I'll work them into the heavier sets to try to get a few more reps. I've personally just always been proud of my grip strength.

Keep hitting it hard Evan, I'll keep you posted on my dieting progress in a few weeks...

Thanks for all the help and support man - you're like the guidance counselor we all wished we had growing up! haha


I told you that you would feel great on Keto! No one believes me. For stiff legs, I use straps because my back is a lot stronger than my grip. I know they are stiff leg deadlifts but if I keep my legs completely straight, then it stretches in back of the knee too much. For me, bending my knees SLIGHTLY, shifts the stress to my upper hams and my glutes and takes the stress of the knees.When I lower the bar I pictuer keeping my back as striqaght and tense as possible (keeping my shoulder blades back) and I bring the bar out past my toes. On the positive, I try to picture pulling with my hams and when I reach the top, I shift my hips forward and squeeze my glutes and hams. Repeat! Good luck buddy.

Ox
03-10-08, 7:44 pm
Hey Ox,

I know its coming a little late, but I wanted to thank you for signing my MD at the Cage last weekend. Keep up all the good work. Can't wait to see what you have in store for us the next time your on stage.

Broc

No problem at all. Thanks for coming by. Peace.

Ox
03-10-08, 7:46 pm
Hey ox.... how long do you cut the fats out of your diet completely...Like when your just eating your fish/chicken/veggies?? Not eggs or nuts or anything?? And if your pre-judging is around like noon what time do u eat breakfast?

It depends on how good/bad of shape I'm in. Last show, I only had to cut em out for a week or so. I've had to cut em out for as many as 4 weeks. If I looked great with them in, I would NEVER eliminate them. All deoends on what is necessary. The day of the show I would eat at eight and ten.

Ox
03-10-08, 7:48 pm
Hey Ox

I was just at your site and went through your whole bio section, and I just have to say that I know how it feels when you're a kid and you're the biggest one in your classroom, and at the soccer team... and at the pool parties... So I just wanted to congratulate you on overcoming all of that and becoming a succesful bodybuilder and thank you for the motivation that this represents. I have to admit that it is still difficult for me to take off my shirt sometimes cause I'm nowhere near where I want to be, but I've improved over the years.

Also, I posted a question for you regarding your diet, supps and training and already found the answer to your diet by reading the article you wrote "Zero Carb Method" and I think I read somewhere that your training really doesn't change that much from bulking to cutting, did I imagine this or am I on the right path?

Anyway, thanks for all of your input, dedication, motivation and the time you invest in helping us all out by answering our endless questions.

Really appreciate it bro.

Hey man, glad you liked the bio. Thank you. Between offseason and pre-contest my training does not change at all.

Pizzalamp
03-10-08, 7:49 pm
Hey Evan
Good seeing you on Saturday-you def put on some serious noticeable size since the last time you were at Tommy Ks.

Ive got a question on your peanut butter shakes during keto.

In that muscle meals video on MDTV you had said how you premix your shakes ahead of time.
Im a bit confused.

Do you put the powder and peanut butter in your shaker cups, and then just add water? Or do you do it differently?

I always just carry the peanut butter jar and tablespoon with me and have it along with my shakes.

Thanks!

Also-you should check out Peanut Butter & Company peanut butter, best tasting natural peanut butter I ever had. Its made in Greenwich Village and its in grocery stores around here.

vIShuS
03-10-08, 9:32 pm
evan! its nice to see a post with your vital information involved haha congrats on turning pro, and also getting front cover for muscular development. your back workout story was inspiring, just flaring and thick....flawless man. Anyways, to get to the point, i was reading the review on how the cage went at the arnold and they said you told the people on how your no carb dieting goes! i too am on a no carb cycle preparing for my first show! im 11 weeks out and have a cheat meal every saturday night (or last meal of the day, not too late).

I was just wondering on how you do your no carb dieting? cheat meals? food involved? fats? when do you carb up if you do at all? Any info would be greatly appreciated.

thanks bro,

vISHuS

jer
03-10-08, 9:44 pm
Hey Evan
Good seeing you on Saturday-you def put on some serious noticeable size since the last time you were at Tommy Ks.

Ive got a question on your peanut butter shakes during keto.

In that muscle meals video on MDTV you had said how you premix your shakes ahead of time.
Im a bit confused.

Do you put the powder and peanut butter in your shaker cups, and then just add water? Or do you do it differently?

I always just carry the peanut butter jar and tablespoon with me and have it along with my shakes.

Thanks!

Also-you should check out Peanut Butter & Company peanut butter, best tasting natural peanut butter I ever had. Its made in Greenwich Village and its in grocery stores around here.

I've seen the MDTV episode and I'm pretty sure he uses a blender to mix it up. I don't think a shaker cup would do the trick.

BTW, I love those videos. I love when Evan goes on little rants about plastic and fish from Asia. Just funny shit.

Pizzalamp
03-10-08, 9:46 pm
I've seen the MDTV episode and I'm pretty sure he uses a blender to mix it up. I don't think a shaker cup would do the trick.

BTW, I love those videos. I love when Evan goes on little rants about plastic and fish from Asia. Just funny shit.

i def love those videos
i hope u guys do more of them
maybe some off season meals??

can u put peanut butter in the blender w/ dry powder?? ive never tried-i would think it would make a mess??

Ozkar
03-10-08, 9:53 pm
Hey man, glad you liked the bio. Thank you. Between offseason and pre-contest my training does not change at all.

Thanks man, really appreciate it.

Alpha 73
03-12-08, 10:24 am
hey i was talkin to this guy at the ON booth at the arnold this year but i dont remember his name but he said something bout a way to gain mass by going heavy for 2 sets for four reps one week and then using the same weight the next week except this time doin it for 6 reps until u go up to eight reps and then u go up weight and back down to 4 reps. My question is have u ever heard of this and does it work? my bad if its hard to follow but thats the best way i could put it. thanks

escholar05
03-12-08, 12:53 pm
Ox,

Once again, it was great getting to train with you the friday of the arnold weekend. I'm still doing the shoulder workout, and its still makes me sore as hell. Anyways, since I've stopped dieting until it gets closer to pre-contest time, I wanted to pick your brain a little bit about bulking diets. I've been reading about bulking diets that are high-protein, moderate carb, moderate fat (like 40/30/30). Basically, I just added carbs at 4 meals to my keto diet that I did based on your keto diet. What do you think about something like this? What do you reccomend?

Wasteland
03-12-08, 1:26 pm
Hey Ox, just read your article on essential fatty acids: http://animalpak.com/html/article_details.cfm?ID=401

Great read. I saw you take something on the order of 12,000+ mg of EFAs per day. I personally get anywhere from 4,000-7,000 daily. Do you take more because of your size and because you're an elite bodybuilder? Should I take more or am I fine with what I take? Thanks.

Lunatic001
03-12-08, 2:49 pm
Just wanted to say that your article about EFA's "Essential" is a great read bro.....also you are looking solid in the cover of MD......You and House will tear the pro ranks....KEEP up the good work and you both motivate me to keep on lifting...

Lunatic001

Ox
03-12-08, 7:10 pm
Hey Evan
Good seeing you on Saturday-you def put on some serious noticeable size since the last time you were at Tommy Ks.

Ive got a question on your peanut butter shakes during keto.

In that muscle meals video on MDTV you had said how you premix your shakes ahead of time.
Im a bit confused.

Do you put the powder and peanut butter in your shaker cups, and then just add water? Or do you do it differently?

I always just carry the peanut butter jar and tablespoon with me and have it along with my shakes.

Thanks!

Also-you should check out Peanut Butter & Company peanut butter, best tasting natural peanut butter I ever had. Its made in Greenwich Village and its in grocery stores around here.

The way I like to do it is I put 3 cups of water in a blender, some ice, and 6 tablespoons of peanut butter then I add 8 or 9 scoops of powder. I make all three shakes at once and then divy em up evenly into 3 shaker cups. If they are a little thick I add some water to each shaker. Thats how I do it. Peanut Butter & co huh? I'll check em out. Thanks.

Ox
03-12-08, 7:11 pm
hey i was talkin to this guy at the ON booth at the arnold this year but i dont remember his name but he said something bout a way to gain mass by going heavy for 2 sets for four reps one week and then using the same weight the next week except this time doin it for 6 reps until u go up to eight reps and then u go up weight and back down to 4 reps. My question is have u ever heard of this and does it work? my bad if its hard to follow but thats the best way i could put it. thanks

I don't know..I've never tried it. Sounds more like powerlifting to me. Could work...give it a try.

Ox
03-12-08, 7:14 pm
Ox,

Once again, it was great getting to train with you the friday of the arnold weekend. I'm still doing the shoulder workout, and its still makes me sore as hell. Anyways, since I've stopped dieting until it gets closer to pre-contest time, I wanted to pick your brain a little bit about bulking diets. I've been reading about bulking diets that are high-protein, moderate carb, moderate fat (like 40/30/30). Basically, I just added carbs at 4 meals to my keto diet that I did based on your keto diet. What do you think about something like this? What do you reccomend?

Glad you like the workout..hahaha. For the offseason, just take your keto diet and add carbs to each meal so that you are taking in the same amount of carbs as protein. Simple.

Ox
03-12-08, 7:18 pm
Hey Ox, just read your article on essential fatty acids: http://animalpak.com/html/article_details.cfm?ID=401

Great read. I saw you take something on the order of 12,000+ mg of EFAs per day. I personally get anywhere from 4,000-7,000 daily. Do you take more because of your size and because you're an elite bodybuilder? Should I take more or am I fine with what I take? Thanks.

I think that because we are talking about something that is essential we all need more or less the same amount. If we were tlaking about overall fat intake (non-essential fats that we take in for fuel and calories) I would need more than you as it would be based on size and caloric demands. But when talking about the essentials I would say that what each individual requires is roughly the same.

Ox
03-12-08, 7:19 pm
Just wanted to say that your article about EFA's "Essential" is a great read bro.....also you are looking solid in the cover of MD......You and House will tear the pro ranks....KEEP up the good work and you both motivate me to keep on lifting...

Lunatic001

I'm glad you enjoyed the article...Thanks buddy.

Joseb
03-12-08, 7:29 pm
hey ox. i have a question about supps.
i've been wanting to add in a workout drink and i dont know which to choose, shock therapy or storm. which one is better in general.

SQUAT or DIE!
03-12-08, 7:34 pm
hey ox. i have a question about supps.
i've been wanting to add in a workout drink and i dont know which to choose, shock therapy or storm. which one is better in general.

i know everyone has there preferences, i like to sip on EAA's and half serving of SHOCK..

NickSP
03-12-08, 8:20 pm
Aright so I may be jumping on the fatty acid bandwagon. Here's a question though, what about PWO? Do you think there's any special benefit or advantage to taking FAs after lifting? or even timed around cardio?

Wasteland
03-13-08, 12:27 pm
I think that because we are talking about something that is essential we all need more or less the same amount. If we were tlaking about overall fat intake (non-essential fats that we take in for fuel and calories) I would need more than you as it would be based on size and caloric demands. But when talking about the essentials I would say that what each individual requires is roughly the same.

That's what I thought as well. I'll stick to my current dosing schedule, thanks Ox. When the new Animal Omega comes out, I'll just use a single pack daily.

Pizzalamp
03-13-08, 8:03 pm
thanks evan

TheNaturalTank
03-14-08, 12:12 am
Hey Evan, I came up with another question for you. How times a day do you do cardio, and at what times, for what reasons?

Also, if you do cardio as soon as you wake up before eating anything is this risking more muscle than if you were to do it 30 minutes after breakfast after you've got some nutrients in your body?

jonnydunz
03-15-08, 12:14 am
great page after page on here OX. you are really ahead of your time man with the knowledge base that you have in this lifestyle. man i respect what you offer to all of us here in this forvm. i had a chance to read your post from the beginning and i have learned alot from those pages. i have made the changes that i need to make in my nutrition as well and i am seeing a difference. i have been taking this Omega Complex and it has been helping me out tremendously. i will be following you career as well as your advice and i hope to one day see you face to face as well. you and the rest of the Animals keep me motivated. stay strong and focused at all times bro.peace

Ox
03-15-08, 11:08 am
Aright so I may be jumping on the fatty acid bandwagon. Here's a question though, what about PWO? Do you think there's any special benefit or advantage to taking FAs after lifting? or even timed around cardio?

Personally, I do not think they should be taken around your workout. Because they can have an effect on inflammation (which you do not want to inhibit right before or after your training) they should be taken at least a few hours before or after workout. I'm no scientist...this is just my thought.

Ox
03-15-08, 11:11 am
Hey Evan, I came up with another question for you. How times a day do you do cardio, and at what times, for what reasons?

Also, if you do cardio as soon as you wake up before eating anything is this risking more muscle than if you were to do it 30 minutes after breakfast after you've got some nutrients in your body?

Once I get up to more than an hour per day I split it into 2 sessions...The first one in the morning on an empty stomach as soon as I wake up and the other one PWO. If you do your cardio after you eat, you will just be burning the food you ate as opposed to tapping into your bodyfat stores becasue they are the only energy source available.

Ox
03-15-08, 11:12 am
great page after page on here OX. you are really ahead of your time man with the knowledge base that you have in this lifestyle. man i respect what you offer to all of us here in this forvm. i had a chance to read your post from the beginning and i have learned alot from those pages. i have made the changes that i need to make in my nutrition as well and i am seeing a difference. i have been taking this Omega Complex and it has been helping me out tremendously. i will be following you career as well as your advice and i hope to one day see you face to face as well. you and the rest of the Animals keep me motivated. stay strong and focused at all times bro.peace

Thanks brother...knowing that this info is being put to good use means a lot to me. I'm glad you find it useful. Peace.

mchik
03-15-08, 11:55 am
Ox,

I was reading the article about the future of women's bodybuilding in the latest issued of MD (cause i'm a girl), and I just wanted to say that the spread of you and Britt was very cool. It was pretty neat to see an amazing new pro like you and my favorite female competitor side by side. Good stuff!

mark_Lamb
03-15-08, 1:12 pm
Hey ox so im 5 weeks out from my comp today and im not where id like to be so I decided to cut a few things out of my diet and I want your opinion on it. Im down to 187lbs in the morning im not too sure my bodyfat % its very low but I seem to be holding a large amount of water. I decided to cut out peanut butter and cashews and no more salmon or steak my current diet looks like this:
1. 2 whole eggs 6 whites
2. 2scoops protein (180 calories 1gram carbs, 40grams protein)
3. 8ounces of boneless skinless chicken, 1 cup spinich
4. Same as meal 2
5. 8 ounces of chicken 1 cup spinich
6. 8ounces of tuna
Let me know what you think bro im also up to 1hour and a half of cardio a day (1hour in the monring and 30min after my workout) Either on the treadmill, stepper or eliptical

TheNaturalTank
03-15-08, 4:09 pm
Once I get up to more than an hour per day I split it into 2 sessions...The first one in the morning on an empty stomach as soon as I wake up and the other one PWO. If you do your cardio after you eat, you will just be burning the food you ate as opposed to tapping into your bodyfat stores becasue they are the only energy source available.

They say when you wake up your body is feeding on your protein(muscles) for energy so if I went and did cardio as soon as I get up wouldn't I be risking the loss of muscle? I'm just trying to do his the best way possible.

Also what do you think would be better for burning fat and keeping metabolism high: 2 sessions of 30 minutes(one in morning, one PWO like you said), or just one session of 45-60 minutes?

ChandlerXJ
03-15-08, 4:10 pm
Evan, the diet is going great - get the first cheat meal tomorrow night - Don't really know exactly what I'm gonna have because I haven't been craving anything lately...

Anyway, I'm doing 40 minutes of cardio post workout, and 40 minutes first thing in the morning on my off days. At what point during my prep do you think I should bump it up to 50, 60, split to two sessions 60/10, 60/20, etc. . .

Also, when should total cardio time follow a 10 minute increment as I add it on?

I really don't know where to start with this - I think this is the last piece of the puzzle...

Thanks for all the help Evan, can't thank you enough. By the way - the new MD article is insane. I'd love for them to go through different body parts with you for each feature. We got your guns, back... we need your legs and delts!

Ox
03-15-08, 6:22 pm
Hey ox so im 5 weeks out from my comp today and im not where id like to be so I decided to cut a few things out of my diet and I want your opinion on it. Im down to 187lbs in the morning im not too sure my bodyfat % its very low but I seem to be holding a large amount of water. I decided to cut out peanut butter and cashews and no more salmon or steak my current diet looks like this:
1. 2 whole eggs 6 whites
2. 2scoops protein (180 calories 1gram carbs, 40grams protein)
3. 8ounces of boneless skinless chicken, 1 cup spinich
4. Same as meal 2
5. 8 ounces of chicken 1 cup spinich
6. 8ounces of tuna
Let me know what you think bro im also up to 1hour and a half of cardio a day (1hour in the monring and 30min after my workout) Either on the treadmill, stepper or eliptical

That should do the trick. You've done exactly how I do if/when I decide I need to be in better shape. Roll with it. You shouldn't be holding much water though. I would opt for asparagus rather than spinach.

sanga
03-15-08, 6:27 pm
Once I get up to more than an hour per day I split it into 2 sessions...The first one in the morning on an empty stomach as soon as I wake up and the other one PWO. If you do your cardio after you eat, you will just be burning the food you ate as opposed to tapping into your bodyfat stores becasue they are the only energy source available.

But wouldn`t this depend on what you`ve eaten and how long it takes to digest?

I mean if you had a shake and then did your cardio 15 minutes later then I agree but what if you`d just eaten a 12oz steak?

Ox
03-15-08, 6:33 pm
Ox,

I was reading the article about the future of women's bodybuilding in the latest issued of MD (cause i'm a girl), and I just wanted to say that the spread of you and Britt was very cool. It was pretty neat to see an amazing new pro like you and my favorite female competitor side by side. Good stuff!

Thanks...I'm glad you liked it. I definitely believe that if female bodybuilding is going to survive then the look has to change. Women who look like men with long hair is not gonna cut it! Britt is definitely a refreshing change to the current crop of women athletes. she has a great physique and has not lost her femininity...in fact, a lot of guys find her really attractive. She has some serious development but has not compromised her femininity...that's impressive. Maybe some of the women push it too hard and fail to recognize that maybe they don't have the gentic potential and have to resort to such drastic measures to built a competitive physique. Britt definitely has genetics on her side. When you see a bodybuilder (male or female) who has a healthy look and does not look like they've resorted to drastic measures to build their physiques, it really shows up nice. I think it really affirms the notion that you do not need to jeopordize your health to built a great physique....and if someone finds themselves risking their health to be competitive on a bodybuilding stage then perhaps they should re-evaluate their priorities. She looks great and right now, it looks as if she IS THE future of female bodybuilding. She should be an inspiration to female bodbyuilders and at the same time, serve as a standard as to what is and is not acceptable for the female athletes. She just may change the sport around for the women and steer it in the right direction.

Ox
03-15-08, 6:35 pm
But wouldn`t this depend on what you`ve eaten and how long it takes to digest?

I mean if you had a shake and then did your cardio 15 minutes later then I agree but what if you`d just eaten a 12oz steak?

If you'd just eaten a 12 oz steak then you'd be working that off. I have never heard of anyone eating a steak and doing their cardio...bad idea trust me.

sanga
03-15-08, 6:36 pm
Ox I have a question about sleep if you could answer please.

I try to get 8-9 hours a night and fall asleep within a few minutes, problem is I wake up after about 10-15 mins and can`t get back to sleep for 30 mins or so, any ideas why this would happen, it happens 4-5 times a week, just annoying more than anything.

Maybe taking something to keep me asleep make help, thoughts?

Ox
03-15-08, 6:45 pm
They say when you wake up your body is feeding on your protein(muscles) for energy so if I went and did cardio as soon as I get up wouldn't I be risking the loss of muscle? I'm just trying to do his the best way possible.

Also what do you think would be better for burning fat and keeping metabolism high: 2 sessions of 30 minutes(one in morning, one PWO like you said), or just one session of 45-60 minutes?

First of all, sleep is not a catabolic process. I don't think you run the risk of buring muscle while you sleep...if you are burning muscle while you sleep then the odds are against you. Why would your body not resort to burning fat for "energy" while you sleep. Besides, how much energy do you think your body actually requires to support your sleep? Not much.

If you are dieting properly, when you get up and do cardio on an empty stomach (assuming you keep your heart rate between 120 and 130 and not over) your body should tap into it's fat stores, not your muscle. However, if you're running a low to moderate carb diet, you will first burn glycogen and then your body will more likely resort to eating up protein for energy...but not if you do zero carbs.

If you're so worried about catabolism and burning up your muscle then why would you consider doing an hour straight of cardio? I would do an hour if I felt like it or 2 30 min sessions if I felt like that but it doesn't matter to ME because I know that I'm not gonna burn muscle. If you're that worried about it then maybe you should do two sessions.

One word of caution I will give you: DON'T BE AFRAID TO DIET! Everyone is afraid of losing muscle and that's why when show time comes around either A. guys decide not to compete because they are not in the shape they need to be in or B. guys get on stage and are not nearly ripped enough. Just diet and get shredded!...if you're too worried about losing muscle you will never get into the shape you need to be in.

Ox
03-15-08, 6:46 pm
Ox I have a question about sleep if you could answer please.

I try to get 8-9 hours a night and fall asleep within a few minutes, problem is I wake up after about 10-15 mins and can`t get back to sleep for 30 mins or so, any ideas why this would happen, it happens 4-5 times a week, just annoying more than anything.

Maybe taking something to keep me asleep make help, thoughts?

You're stressed out! Clear your head and you'll sleep and stay asleep.

sanga
03-15-08, 7:08 pm
If you'd just eaten a 12 oz steak then you'd be working that off. I have never heard of anyone eating a steak and doing their cardio...bad idea trust me.

Lol, I wouldn`t do it.

sanga
03-15-08, 7:10 pm
You're stressed out! Clear your head and you'll sleep and stay asleep.


Yeah you are right, I am in the process of doing the house up and about to place on the market, I am looking for another job and I`m training like an animal possesed, things will settle once the house and job are sorted.

Thanks.

born0withno0soul
03-15-08, 7:14 pm
ox do you believe in any oblique work during competition preperation?

naturalguy
03-15-08, 7:17 pm
One word of caution I will give you: DON'T BE AFRAID TO DIET! Everyone is afraid of losing muscle and that's why when show time comes around either A. guys decide not to compete because they are not in the shape they need to be in or B. guys get on stage and are not nearly ripped enough. Just diet and get shredded!...if you're too worried about losing muscle you will never get into the shape you need to be in.

You are so right but it's a mental game. When your dieting you start feeling small and that can play with your mind.

mark_Lamb
03-15-08, 8:22 pm
That should do the trick. You've done exactly how I do if/when I decide I need to be in better shape. Roll with it. You shouldn't be holding much water though. I would opt for asparagus rather than spinach.



Thanks for the advice ox how would you cycle the cheat meal though? Would you still do one everyweek? Or would you cut back on them altogether and just rely on the diet

TheNaturalTank
03-15-08, 8:24 pm
First of all, sleep is not a catabolic process. I don't think you run the risk of buring muscle while you sleep...if you are burning muscle while you sleep then the odds are against you. Why would your body not resort to burning fat for "energy" while you sleep. Besides, how much energy do you think your body actually requires to support your sleep? Not much.

If you are dieting properly, when you get up and do cardio on an empty stomach (assuming you keep your heart rate between 120 and 130 and not over) your body should tap into it's fat stores, not your muscle. However, if you're running a low to moderate carb diet, you will first burn glycogen and then your body will more likely resort to eating up protein for energy...but not if you do zero carbs.

If you're so worried about catabolism and burning up your muscle then why would you consider doing an hour straight of cardio? I would do an hour if I felt like it or 2 30 min sessions if I felt like that but it doesn't matter to ME because I know that I'm not gonna burn muscle. If you're that worried about it then maybe you should do two sessions.

One word of caution I will give you: DON'T BE AFRAID TO DIET! Everyone is afraid of losing muscle and that's why when show time comes around either A. guys decide not to compete because they are not in the shape they need to be in or B. guys get on stage and are not nearly ripped enough. Just diet and get shredded!...if you're too worried about losing muscle you will never get into the shape you need to be in.

Alright thanks alot man. I'll report back with my progress in a few weeks.

Ox
03-15-08, 11:01 pm
Yeah you are right, I am in the process of doing the house up and about to place on the market, I am looking for another job and I`m training like an animal possesed, things will settle once the house and job are sorted.

Thanks.

Try taking a bath in epsom salt right before bed...the magnesium should help knock you out and it's good for your muscles too. You can also take magnesium internally for the purpose of calming you down...just be careful because too much of it internally will make you have diarreha.

Ox
03-15-08, 11:05 pm
You are so right but it's a mental game. When your dieting you start feeling small and that can play with your mind.

TRUE...the whole damn thing is a mental game. You have to push yourself to the limit and train with the utmost of intensity...but you have to be sane enough not to let your ego get the best of you and allow you to overtrain. It's all balance. More isn't always better...sometimes less is more etc etc. The way I feel about bodybuilding or simply achieveing any fitness oriented goal is that to be successfull means knowing how much to give, when to give it and how to give it....it's all balance. And to me, that's all mental.

Ox
03-15-08, 11:07 pm
Thanks for the advice ox how would you cycle the cheat meal though? Would you still do one everyweek? Or would you cut back on them altogether and just rely on the diet

If you're not where you need to be I would eliminate it. If your borderline I would have a regualr meal but add 75g of carbs to it rather than an all out cheat meal.

sanga
03-16-08, 4:04 pm
Try taking a bath in epsom salt right before bed...the magnesium should help knock you out and it's good for your muscles too. You can also take magnesium internally for the purpose of calming you down...just be careful because too much of it internally will make you have diarreha.


Thanks for the tip Ox, much approeciated mate.

Lunatic001
03-18-08, 2:09 pm
Ox,

First of all, just want to ask how the training going? You look great on the cover of MD. any date for you pro debut? I guess here goes my question(s):

I consider myself carb sensitive (after following dieting advice from you, House, and Tiny) I have tried high carbs, low carbs, no carbs (a month before I got real sick during the winter) and I came to that conclusion. With high carbs training was great, but my fat grows faster than muscle. I was doing great with no carbs but then I got bronchitis and was out for a couple of days. I guess my question is how do you recommend a person like me (new to dieting) transition to your type of diet (which I believe will work the best for me and I am aware of your formula for one's macros breakdown)? How could be adjust the keto diet when bulking or cutting? I know it will take time to adapt but I am willing to do what it takes. What supps are a must have for keto (I know Animal Omega will be a staple)? Last but not least, what do you suggest (excercises wise) to use to bring up my legs/calves?

Thanks for your time,
Lunatic001

Ox
03-18-08, 5:54 pm
Ox,

First of all, just want to ask how the training going? You look great on the cover of MD. any date for you pro debut? I guess here goes my question(s):

I consider myself carb sensitive (after following dieting advice from you, House, and Tiny) I have tried high carbs, low carbs, no carbs (a month before I got real sick during the winter) and I came to that conclusion. With high carbs training was great, but my fat grows faster than muscle. I was doing great with no carbs but then I got bronchitis and was out for a couple of days. I guess my question is how do you recommend a person like me (new to dieting) transition to your type of diet (which I believe will work the best for me and I am aware of your formula for one's macros breakdown)? How could be adjust the keto diet when bulking or cutting? I know it will take time to adapt but I am willing to do what it takes. What supps are a must have for keto (I know Animal Omega will be a staple)? Last but not least, what do you suggest (excercises wise) to use to bring up my legs/calves?

Thanks for your time,
Lunatic001

You probably ARE carb sensitive...most of us are. The consumption of carbohyrdates, namely refined carbohydrates, as a dietary staple is something relatively new to the human race. Simply put, we have not evolved to run off so many carbs, let alone refined ones. So congrats on your ability to think for yourself and listen to your body despite what you have been told you "need" for energy, growth etc. Now, to make the transition, you don't make any transition at all...you just make the switch. That's actually the easiest way and the quickest. The sooner you eliminate all carbs, the quicker you'll snap into ketosis and feel energetic and mentally clear. The keo diet would not be adjusted for dieting because that's what the keto diet is...a diet for getting leaner and dieting. When bulking, you would just take your keto diet and add carbs in an amount equal to your protein intake. For example, if you have 50g of protein per meal on your keto diet then you would just add 50g to each meal when you are ready to bulk. Very simple.
As for supps, whether you are bulking or cutting, Animal Pak is a staple. Animal Omega will fit in so well with the keto diet...it's a must. I would roll with Universal's IsoWhey for my protein source and I would throw in Nitro PWO and during cardio.
For bringing up your legs, all you need is the squat. Lots and lots and lots of squats. And if you're gonna make excuses why you can't do them (bad back, bad knees, you're too tall, your friend told you a trainer at Planet Fitness said they're bad for you etc etc) don't even bother. You can do all the leg presses, lunges, extensions, and machine squats you want but they will not grow like they would with weekly squatting. Even if you have insane genetics for legs, you still need to squat. SO SQUAT! I would reccomend going into the gym (preferably on Monday before you have trained anyhting else that week) and doing ten sets of squats. Anything else you do after that is just icing on the cake. Squats ARE the workout.

Lunatic001
03-18-08, 5:59 pm
You probably ARE carb sensitive...most of us are. The consumption of carbohyrdates, namely refined carbohydrates, as a dietary staple is something relatively new to the human race. Simply put, we have not evolved to run off so many carbs, let alone refined ones. So congrats on your ability to think for yourself and listen to your body despite what you have been told you "need" for energy, growth etc. Now, to make the transition, you don't make any transition at all...you just make the switch. That's actually the easiest way and the quickest. The sooner you eliminate all carbs, the quicker you'll snap into ketosis and feel energetic and mentally clear. The keo diet would not be adjusted for dieting because that's what the keto diet is...a diet for getting leaner and dieting. When bulking, you would just take your keto diet and add carbs in an amount equal to your protein intake. For example, if you have 50g of protein per meal on your keto diet then you would just add 50g to each meal when you are ready to bulk. Very simple.
As for supps, whether you are bulking or cutting, Animal Pak is a staple. Animal Omega will fit in so well with the keto diet...it's a must. I would roll with Universal's IsoWhey for my protein source and I would throw in Nitro PWO and during cardio.
For bringing up your legs, all you need is the squat. Lots and lots and lots of squats. And if you're gonna make excuses why you can't do them (bad back, bad knees, you're too tall, your friend told you a trainer at Planet Fitness said they're bad for you etc etc) don't even bother. You can do all the leg presses, lunges, extensions, and machine squats you want but they will not grow like they would with weekly squatting. Even if you have insane genetics for legs, you still need to squat. SO SQUAT! I would reccomend going into the gym (preferably on Monday before you have trained anyhting else that week) and doing ten sets of squats. Anything else you do after that is just icing on the cake. Squats ARE the workout.

Ox,

Thanks for the help and I will do the switch. For legs I will switch them to the first thing in my split and squat like no tommorrow....

Much Appreciated,
Lunatic001

ChandlerXJ
03-18-08, 9:00 pm
Evan, I'm really focusing on setting the blueprints for next off-season with my pre-contest training now, working on getting the form on my squats and stiff legged deads straight - as they are part of how I train now anyways...

I tried what you suggested for the stiff legged deads - but not only are my hams shot today, but my upper middle back, I'd say between the lower part of the shoulder blades, is very sore... What do you think, do you think I'm still pulling from my back?

I stood on a stair stepper, grabbed the bar about shoulder width, bent the knees ever so slightly, bend down from the waist with my head up and back straight, and brought the bar to my feet, I envisioned the pull from my hams on the way up and squeezed the shit out of them and my glutes at the top...

Also, I read many places you reworked your squat, what exactly did you do, take me through your squat if you can because whatever you did fucking WORKED... I guess this is a two part evan centopani leg series we got going here...

I appreciate all the help evan

jonnydunz
03-18-08, 9:04 pm
whats good OX, hope that your training is going great and that all is well in your life as well. i have not had the opportunity to read MD yet, but I will get the magazine tomorrow and check out your article. i have been reading about the diet that you and others are on called Keto. i see that it involves no carbs at all. i am looking to get myself into the best shape of my life. i want to lose the bodyfat and of course maintain my size. i am 6'7" and 275lbs right now. i would like to get down to about 255lbs. what do you recommend.

waslate
03-19-08, 12:28 pm
I am about to start my cut in a little less than a week and was just hammering out the details. Would it be wrong to take shock therapy prewo while on a keto diet?

ROC1291
03-19-08, 1:40 pm
I am about to start my cut in a little less than a week and was just hammering out the details. Would it be wrong to take shock therapy prewo while on a keto diet?

this has been answered for me before.
It has 8g of carbs so you should not use it.

Bad.Man.56
03-19-08, 3:00 pm
Hey Evan,

I'd just like to thank you for answering all my questions a few pages back. With that, I was finally able to start my keto diet, and have on it for a week now, and feel great. So, thanks again for all the info on the diet. I also had another question for you regarding training. I was reading about the double split workout in the modern encyclopedia for bodybuilding, and I was wondering what your feelings were regarding this approach to training. Also if you felt this type of training would be good for someone not on anabolics. Thanks again evan

cornfed86
03-19-08, 3:10 pm
Hey Ox, i've got a fairly big question about my diet. i did a 7month bulk and put on a good 35 pounds and now i'm cutting down. i'm 5'10", 180lbs, with around 12-13% b/f, and 21yrs old. i'm trying keto this time around and i need some help. another forvm member told me to keep my protein and fat the same for every meal but it's a little tough because i'm in college, i work, and i intern at a hospital. here's my daily meal plan....

6:30am - 7 egg whites, 2 whole eggs ( 54g protein 9g fat)
9:30am - 1 cup chicken breast, 1/4 cup of almonds & walnuts (48g protein, 16g fat)
12:00noon - 1 cup chicken breast, 1/4 cup of nuts ( 48g protein, 16g fat)
2:00pm - same ( 48g protein, 16g fat)
4:30pm - protein bar (30g protein, 16g fat, 6g carbs)
6:30pm - 1scoop whey isolate, 2tbsp natty pb (27g protein,16g fat ) pre-WO
7:30pm - BCAA's
8:30pm - 2scoops whey isolate (54g protein) post-WO
10:00pm - 7 egg whites, 2 whole eggs (54g protein, 9g fat)

any help would be greatly appreciated brother. thank you in advance.

waslate
03-19-08, 5:34 pm
I am about to start my cut in a little less than a week and was just hammering out the details. Would it be wrong to take shock therapy prewo while on a keto diet?


this has been answered for me before.
It has 8g of carbs so you should not use it.

I take back my question. Just looked around your thread a little bit and I realized that this has been asked many times before.

Ox
03-19-08, 5:57 pm
Evan, I'm really focusing on setting the blueprints for next off-season with my pre-contest training now, working on getting the form on my squats and stiff legged deads straight - as they are part of how I train now anyways...

I tried what you suggested for the stiff legged deads - but not only are my hams shot today, but my upper middle back, I'd say between the lower part of the shoulder blades, is very sore... What do you think, do you think I'm still pulling from my back?

I stood on a stair stepper, grabbed the bar about shoulder width, bent the knees ever so slightly, bend down from the waist with my head up and back straight, and brought the bar to my feet, I envisioned the pull from my hams on the way up and squeezed the shit out of them and my glutes at the top...

Also, I read many places you reworked your squat, what exactly did you do, take me through your squat if you can because whatever you did fucking WORKED... I guess this is a two part evan centopani leg series we got going here...

I appreciate all the help evan


It's innevitable that you will still use some back...so long as your hams are cooked that's all that matters. I wouldn't stand on a stair stepper though...I think that it's too deep of a stretch and rounding your back become innevitable. As for squats, I just widened my stance and learned to use my inner thighs, hips and glutes rather than just my quads and knees.

Ox
03-19-08, 5:58 pm
whats good OX, hope that your training is going great and that all is well in your life as well. i have not had the opportunity to read MD yet, but I will get the magazine tomorrow and check out your article. i have been reading about the diet that you and others are on called Keto. i see that it involves no carbs at all. i am looking to get myself into the best shape of my life. i want to lose the bodyfat and of course maintain my size. i am 6'7" and 275lbs right now. i would like to get down to about 255lbs. what do you recommend.

I say go keto.

Ox
03-19-08, 6:00 pm
Hey Evan,

I'd just like to thank you for answering all my questions a few pages back. With that, I was finally able to start my keto diet, and have on it for a week now, and feel great. So, thanks again for all the info on the diet. I also had another question for you regarding training. I was reading about the double split workout in the modern encyclopedia for bodybuilding, and I was wondering what your feelings were regarding this approach to training. Also if you felt this type of training would be good for someone not on anabolics. Thanks again evan

I don't know what a double split workout is. How does it go?

Ox
03-19-08, 6:04 pm
Hey Ox, i've got a fairly big question about my diet. i did a 7month bulk and put on a good 35 pounds and now i'm cutting down. i'm 5'10", 180lbs, with around 12-13% b/f, and 21yrs old. i'm trying keto this time around and i need some help. another forvm member told me to keep my protein and fat the same for every meal but it's a little tough because i'm in college, i work, and i intern at a hospital. here's my daily meal plan....

6:30am - 7 egg whites, 2 whole eggs ( 54g protein 9g fat)
9:30am - 1 cup chicken breast, 1/4 cup of almonds & walnuts (48g protein, 16g fat)
12:00noon - 1 cup chicken breast, 1/4 cup of nuts ( 48g protein, 16g fat)
2:00pm - same ( 48g protein, 16g fat)
4:30pm - protein bar (30g protein, 16g fat, 6g carbs)
6:30pm - 1scoop whey isolate, 2tbsp natty pb (27g protein,16g fat ) pre-WO
7:30pm - BCAA's
8:30pm - 2scoops whey isolate (54g protein) post-WO
10:00pm - 7 egg whites, 2 whole eggs (54g protein, 9g fat)

any help would be greatly appreciated brother. thank you in advance.

It's too much food. If you're 13% bf @180 lbs the that leaves you with about 155 lbs of lean mass. That would mean you would only need 155g of protein and 70g of fat per day. Over six meals that leaves you with 26g of protein per meal and 12g of fat. I suggest you rework your diet based on these values. And no protein bars.

Bad.Man.56
03-19-08, 6:19 pm
I don't know what a double split workout is. How does it go?

Sorry about that, the double split workout that I was looking at involves two workouts per day. One of these workouts would be in the morning, and then another muscle group at night. An example split would look like MWF: AM - Chest and back, PM - Thighs and Calves, TuThS: AM Shoulders, Upper Arms, Forearms, Calves, and Abs would be done every day. I was reading this over and thought it was an interesting approach, but it seems as if it could be over training.

BCent
03-19-08, 7:57 pm
SO SQUAT! I would reccomend going into the gym (preferably on Monday before you have trained anyhting else that week) and doing ten sets of squats. Anything else you do after that is just icing on the cake. Squats ARE the workout.

hey OX when you say to to 10 sets of squats, would that be 10 working sets, or 10 sets total, including warmups? thanks for the help man

Ox
03-19-08, 9:54 pm
Sorry about that, the double split workout that I was looking at involves two workouts per day. One of these workouts would be in the morning, and then another muscle group at night. An example split would look like MWF: AM - Chest and back, PM - Thighs and Calves, TuThS: AM Shoulders, Upper Arms, Forearms, Calves, and Abs would be done every day. I was reading this over and thought it was an interesting approach, but it seems as if it could be over training.

We are all different in our our recuperative abilities..but I say fuck that. You'd be in the gym WAY too long and you'd be training everything with too much frequency. I say hit it hard, be sore for days, feed it and let it recuperate. I still think that training each bodypart once per week is the way to go for size gains...it allows you the most time to recuperate and it allows you to really focus on one bodypart per day and hit it hard and give it the attention it needs to really beat it up. "but it seems as if it could be over training"...I second that.

Ox
03-19-08, 9:55 pm
hey OX when you say to to 10 sets of squats, would that be 10 working sets, or 10 sets total, including warmups? thanks for the help man

Warm ups don't count...EVER.

BCent
03-20-08, 4:21 am
Warm ups don't count...EVER.

awesome man, thanks a lot. i figured you were gonna say that so i just went ahead and did my warm ups then 10 sets of squats. holy shit man i could barely walk across campus to my room, gotta be doin somethin right. thanks for ur insight

Bad.Man.56
03-20-08, 2:45 pm
We are all different in our our recuperative abilities..but I say fuck that. You'd be in the gym WAY too long and you'd be training everything with too much frequency. I say hit it hard, be sore for days, feed it and let it recuperate. I still think that training each bodypart once per week is the way to go for size gains...it allows you the most time to recuperate and it allows you to really focus on one bodypart per day and hit it hard and give it the attention it needs to really beat it up. "but it seems as if it could be over training"...I second that.

Thanks Evan, I'll be sticking to my 5 day split, one bodypart per week. Thanks again for all of your guidance.

mustgetbig
03-20-08, 3:17 pm
holy shit that 10 sets you said about doing for leg day with squats it hurts .... bad but its great i think ima stick with that every leg day with leg extensions to warm up then my 10 sets of squats keeping my reps at 5 then leg extensions to kill them i also do hamstrings on leg day too

ITALIANdaSTALION
03-20-08, 5:19 pm
Hey Ox, ive taken the time to read this whole thread and i have a few things to say 1. Your an amazing athlete and a big motivation to many on this forum, and in my mind you are the nicest person in the world taking the time out of your life to answer peoples various quetions. I have a quick question tho about your pre contest diet which calls for no carbs whatsoever, but i consume two protein shakes which i use with milk throughout the day and on the nutriton info of the milk it says there are 30 carbs ???? ? So how would i go about my diet with the carbs in the milk? Will they affect the diet in any way or no?

mark_Lamb
03-20-08, 5:20 pm
ox whats your take on diet pop? Is there any specific time when you would cut it out from the precontest diet? I am drinking alot of it but i still consume a lot of water just looking for you input thanks

jonnydunz
03-21-08, 1:23 am
I say go keto.

sounds like this is the way to go and i will get started on this program and keep all updated on how it is going. i will read up on this more on your post on how to eat and train as well. thanks for your time and all of your great information.ONE

Ox
03-21-08, 9:50 am
Hey Ox, ive taken the time to read this whole thread and i have a few things to say 1. Your an amazing athlete and a big motivation to many on this forum, and in my mind you are the nicest person in the world taking the time out of your life to answer peoples various quetions. I have a quick question tho about your pre contest diet which calls for no carbs whatsoever, but i consume two protein shakes which i use with milk throughout the day and on the nutriton info of the milk it says there are 30 carbs ???? ? So how would i go about my diet with the carbs in the milk? Will they affect the diet in any way or no?

If you're doing a keto diet then no milk. To tell you the truth, you'll feel and look better with no dairy. Just mix your shakes with water and natty Peanut Butter.

Ox
03-21-08, 9:54 am
ox whats your take on diet pop? Is there any specific time when you would cut it out from the precontest diet? I am drinking alot of it but i still consume a lot of water just looking for you input thanks

Personally, I almost never drink diet soda. Maybe the first few weeks of my diet I'll have one a day or something to ease the transition. But in all honesty, I think that the artificial sweeteners are bad for you. I've actually spoken to people who claim to have had aspartame poisoning...it sounded like nasty shit. That aside, I think that having diet soda will make you crave more of it and it's a bad trend to start. Futhermore, there may be some possibility that because it is so sweet, your body may dump some insulin thinking it's going to have to store some sugar...and that's not a good thing. Again, that could be total bullshit but to make a long story short, diet soda is crap. Stay away from it. Besides, diet soda is for fat people.

kcinnitram91
03-21-08, 10:01 am
Hey Ox, first off I'm a huge fan of yours. I had a few questions on my keto diet and supps and was hoping you could look at it. I am about 5"11 or 6"0 and 216 pounds currently, 19 years old.

meal 1:
5 eggs
Pak

TRAIN: EAA Stack during

meal 2:
Iso whey shake
2 teaspoons natty pb

meal 3:
1 can of chicken (60g protein)
1/4 cup of almonds or possibly Omega if I win the promo on another site.
1 cup spinach

meal 4:
1 can of tuna
1/4 cup of almonds

meal 5:
Iso whey shake
2 teaspoons natty pb

Run again: EAA complex
(I am training for boot camp, thats why I'm running so much.)

meal 6:
1 can chicken
1/4 cup of almonds.

Thanks in advance, I appreciate any help you can give me.

ITALIANdaSTALION
03-21-08, 11:35 am
If you're doing a keto diet then no milk. To tell you the truth, you'll feel and look better with no dairy. Just mix your shakes with water and natty Peanut Butter.

Alright thanks ill try that out im planning to start dieting in a bit after a few more weeks of bulking, by the way when is your next show now that your an IFBB pro ? sorry if my questions dont sound intelligent im only 15 so i have alot to learn from a guy like you

bobbymart
03-21-08, 11:43 am
Alright thanks ill try that out im planning to start dieting in a bit after a few more weeks of bulking, by the way when is your next show now that your an IFBB pro ? sorry if my questions dont sound intelligent im only 15 so i have alot to learn from a guy like you

it says you are 22 under you're name???? may want to change that so people can point you in the right direction that makes things allot diff as far as advice goes.

Maccabee
03-21-08, 6:03 pm
Hey Evan, How are you?

You know I came across some of your posts on the forum where you said that you dont have a big appetite and that you eat 6 meals a day. I am not looking for a magic pill...I know I have to work hard...

However, I am just curious to see how a big like you grows with the amount you eat. You make it sound like for your size you dont eat much. Can you direct me to an article or anything like that? Whats your approach to bulking?

mikedfromaz
03-21-08, 9:52 pm
i cant get enough of this thread. trying to get all the info i can to get started in the right direction. right now im sitting at about 195 at about 5'8. i dont ever plan on stepping out on the stage, but i guess like everyone else i would like more size and limit excess fat. i found your precontest diet, but i thought on another page you gave details to your offseason diet where carbs where introduced again. afraid of losing everything ive gained if i follow your pre contest diet, and can you really gain at 2600 cals a day, im the student trying to learn. as with everyone else im grateful for the knowledge that your sharing with the masses. your brother in iron.

ChandlerXJ
03-22-08, 5:12 pm
Evan, concerning what you said on the real gains thread, let me get this straight...

When you're bulking, you're eating relatively clean, 6-7 meals, the 1:1:1 schpiel. Now, you were saying when you get to the point where AFTER you eat, you're STILL hungry and not satisfied, that's the time to add more... are you saying more carbs, more meals, more fats? What did you mean by that...

I'm curious because before I started the diet, I was eating 6 meals, 1:1:1 hitting about 45-50 carbs a meal, and I was literally STARVING my ass off. I didn't know what the fuck was going on, it was like one day, it just wasn't enough. When I started the 1:1:1, I was stuffed, then I started growing and then that magic day happened. However, at this point, I felt like I was just putting on fat... I was getting bigger and harder, but my abs were long gone and I mentally was thinking, wow, this isn't good. Was I mentally wrong? Was this were I should have taken advantage and added more (of what?)?

I appreciate the answer as it's going to give me something to look forward to after I diet down. By the way man, have a good fucking easter and eat big bro.

stronghold
03-22-08, 5:49 pm
Hey Ox, sorry if it has been mentioned in here before, but what was your diet and training like when you were making your initial gains past 200 lbs and up to 275?

mustgetbig
03-22-08, 7:40 pm
ox was wondering if you could check my diet make sure im not screwing it up before this 1 i was doing the low carb cycling and felt like shit but here it is its day 5 on it i weigh 240lbs at 5' 11" and with 26% bodyfat

5:30am-animal cuts,fish oil
6:15am-45mins cardio(heartrate kept around 120)
7am-3oz chicken,1cup spinach,1tbsp EVOO
9:30am-3oz chicken,1 tbsp EVOO
12pm-3oz chicken,1tbsp EVOO,fish oil
2:30pm-3oz chicken,1tbsp EVOO
4pm-animal pak,vitamin c
5pm-3oz chicken-animal cuts-workout-45min cardio
7:30pm-3oz chicken,1cup spinach,1tbsp EVOO
9:30pm-3oz chicken,1tbsp EVOO,fish oil,vitamin c,melatonin


totals- 180grams protein,90grams fat

and is a cheat meal neccasary after the first 2 weeks?

thanks in advance.

born0withno0soul
03-22-08, 11:52 pm
ox i asked you about when you stop lifting before the show. when do you stop doing cardio? does it depend on your conditinong or do you believe in cardio up to the day of the show

kyderz
03-23-08, 12:04 am
Personally, I almost never drink diet soda. Maybe the first few weeks of my diet I'll have one a day or something to ease the transition. But in all honesty, I think that the artificial sweeteners are bad for you. I've actually spoken to people who claim to have had aspartame poisoning...it sounded like nasty shit. That aside, I think that having diet soda will make you crave more of it and it's a bad trend to start. Futhermore, there may be some possibility that because it is so sweet, your body may dump some insulin thinking it's going to have to store some sugar...and that's not a good thing. Again, that could be total bullshit but to make a long story short, diet soda is crap. Stay away from it. Besides, diet soda is for fat people.

Real men eat sugar straight from the bag, right Ox?

Just kidding big guy.

I am starting Keto Monday, 3/24.

Just wanted to tell everyone I hope they have a Happy Easter.

I'll keep ya posted on my diet and training Ox.

Already got the macros figured out....

bovat
03-23-08, 12:26 am
i feel im in the same boat as you. I gain fat just looking at a slice of pizza. But i gain muscle easily, so it isnt all bad. Im on a bulk now, but obviously trying to do it and stay as lean as possible. I need your advice on what my nutrition should look like
im currently taking in
330 g of protein
300 g of carbs
85 g of fat

i was taking in 350 g of carbs, but ive been retaining water like crazy, and i think im gaining fat too. So im gonna try 300 carbs. Then i will be taking in about 3300 cals, wich will be about what im burning a day. Im not sure if i should drop carbs more, because then i will have a caloric deficet. And protein cannot go higher because its hard to get just taht. Should i increase fat, and drop carbs more? whatcha think?

RogueLion
03-23-08, 12:52 am
Saw you at the ABC NJ, and was like, "Whoa, that is the largest human being I have ever seen." Thanks for the ample serving of humble pie, it was delicious. Good luck in future endevours.

-Evan

naturalguy
03-23-08, 6:49 pm
Saw you at the ABC NJ, and was like, "Whoa, that is the largest human being I have ever seen." Thanks for the ample serving of humble pie, it was delicious. Good luck in future endevours.

-Evan

Big Ev was certainly looking large Saturday:

http://i145.photobucket.com/albums/r217/er1994/The%20Cage%202008/Strong%20and%20Shapely%20ABC/StrongandShapelyABC015Small.jpg

Good to see you again Ev.

Big C
03-23-08, 8:12 pm
Hey OX, I read in the new MD that two body parts you worked hard to bring up were your chest and legs this past year.

I have the same problem...my arms/back and shoulders need a lot less work right now than my legs/chest. What were some of the methods you used? Thanks in advance big man. - Big C

TheNaturalTank
03-23-08, 10:16 pm
Hey Ox, I was wondering if you think training tris with chest, and bis with back will get just as much growth as a separate arm day? Arms are a lagging bodypart for me, so i'm just wondering what you think is BEST?

MANABOLIC
03-24-08, 6:36 am
Ox, my man, I really appreciate your efforts and time. I have a bunch of questions that I believe should help most of the dudes out there. I have been training for 12 years, I am 31 years old and I have a small frame, I am not one of the big mass monsters. nonetheless, I am muscular and I weigh 93 kgs, I am 178 cms tall. My training evolves around heavy compound moves, and as little cable stuff as possible, I am all free weights. After my left elbow started giving me some trouble coz of the heavy lifting, I though of switching training styles for a while. here is how it goes now: Legs- Chest/Delts- Back- Arms this cycle is done with heavy weights, my rep range is 6-8, i do 4 sets per exercise. then i rest for 1 day, then I train chest/delts - arms using moderate weights and high reps (20-25 reps per set) this gives me a horrible burn that is so different than the pain you feel when pounding your body with heavy weights. I discovered that you really can't train neithet your back nor legs using light weights, coz i didn't feel sore the next day i did that. after i finish my light days, i rest for a day, then back to heavy again. do ou get my point ? do you second my opinion, or should i go heavy all the time ? i train my calves 3 times a week using heavy weights for 15-20 reps, but they still need work. i feel a painful burn while training them, which i welcome very much coz it makes me feel they are growing. one last thing before i go, is it true that you have to limit your Glutamine intake to 10 grams a day when taking nitrix oxide coz glutamine negates the effects of nitrix ? thanx

Reacher34
03-25-08, 7:58 pm
The juice from a lemon? Is it sugar, or is it acids? What I mean is...can I put lemon juice on my salmon or not (following a keto diet)? What about lemon juice added to my water?

T.Alan
03-26-08, 2:03 am
Here's what my diet looks like pre-contest:

Meal 1: 6 Whole eggs (Eggland's Best)

Meal 2: 1.5 scoops Universal Egg Protein, 1.5 Scoops Universal Specialized Protein for gaining lean Mass, 2 tbsp all natural peanut butter

Meal 3: 8 oz chicken, 2 cups green salad, 1/2 cup raw almonds

Meal 4: same as meal 2

Meal 5: 8 oz salmon, 2 cups green salad, 1tbsp olive oli

Meal 6: same as meals 2+4

This food is delicious.. and thats a problem.. it makes me want more!

Thank you for all you've added to this forum with your thread and the minds you're changing with the "fat" movement.

Hopefully in 12 weeks or so I'll have some abs to show for it.

Ox
03-26-08, 2:52 pm
ox i asked you about when you stop lifting before the show. when do you stop doing cardio? does it depend on your conditinong or do you believe in cardio up to the day of the show

I usually end up stopping cardio on Tuesday for a Friday night or Saturday morning pre-judging. I wouldn't do it up to the day of the show.

Ox
03-26-08, 2:53 pm
i feel im in the same boat as you. I gain fat just looking at a slice of pizza. But i gain muscle easily, so it isnt all bad. Im on a bulk now, but obviously trying to do it and stay as lean as possible. I need your advice on what my nutrition should look like
im currently taking in
330 g of protein
300 g of carbs
85 g of fat

i was taking in 350 g of carbs, but ive been retaining water like crazy, and i think im gaining fat too. So im gonna try 300 carbs. Then i will be taking in about 3300 cals, wich will be about what im burning a day. Im not sure if i should drop carbs more, because then i will have a caloric deficet. And protein cannot go higher because its hard to get just taht. Should i increase fat, and drop carbs more? whatcha think?


The macros look good but if you're just over 200 lbs then you can definitely get by with less carbs than that. Right now you're taking in about what I take in and I'm 280. I would keep the protein and the fat and rop the carbs back to 200g or so.

Ox
03-26-08, 2:55 pm
Saw you at the ABC NJ, and was like, "Whoa, that is the largest human being I have ever seen." Thanks for the ample serving of humble pie, it was delicious. Good luck in future endevours.

-Evan

Largest human being you've ever seen?! I don't know about that but thank you. What an awesome gym.

Ox
03-26-08, 2:56 pm
Big Ev was certainly looking large Saturday:

[Good to see you again Ev.

Always good to see you buddy.

Ox
03-26-08, 2:57 pm
Hey OX, I read in the new MD that two body parts you worked hard to bring up were your chest and legs this past year.

I have the same problem...my arms/back and shoulders need a lot less work right now than my legs/chest. What were some of the methods you used? Thanks in advance big man. - Big C

For legs it's just a matter of more and more squats. For my chest it's all about mind muscle connection and keeping my triceps and shoulders out of whatever movement(s) I do.

Ox
03-26-08, 2:58 pm
Hey Ox, I was wondering if you think training tris with chest, and bis with back will get just as much growth as a separate arm day? Arms are a lagging bodypart for me, so i'm just wondering what you think is BEST?

I never liked the idea because Chest is a fairly large bodypart and back is huge. I think they both deserve their own day. If I tried working anything in with either chest or back I'd be in the gym forever.

bigbull52
03-26-08, 3:00 pm
Ox,

I am fast approaching my show... I have done the keto thing and been very happy..but my question is what does your meal plan look like on thursday/friday to carb up?? Thanks

Ox
03-26-08, 3:03 pm
Ox, my man, I really appreciate your efforts and time. I have a bunch of questions that I believe should help most of the dudes out there. I have been training for 12 years, I am 31 years old and I have a small frame, I am not one of the big mass monsters. nonetheless, I am muscular and I weigh 93 kgs, I am 178 cms tall. My training evolves around heavy compound moves, and as little cable stuff as possible, I am all free weights. After my left elbow started giving me some trouble coz of the heavy lifting, I though of switching training styles for a while. here is how it goes now: Legs- Chest/Delts- Back- Arms this cycle is done with heavy weights, my rep range is 6-8, i do 4 sets per exercise. then i rest for 1 day, then I train chest/delts - arms using moderate weights and high reps (20-25 reps per set) this gives me a horrible burn that is so different than the pain you feel when pounding your body with heavy weights. I discovered that you really can't train neithet your back nor legs using light weights, coz i didn't feel sore the next day i did that. after i finish my light days, i rest for a day, then back to heavy again. do ou get my point ? do you second my opinion, or should i go heavy all the time ? i train my calves 3 times a week using heavy weights for 15-20 reps, but they still need work. i feel a painful burn while training them, which i welcome very much coz it makes me feel they are growing. one last thing before i go, is it true that you have to limit your Glutamine intake to 10 grams a day when taking nitrix oxide coz glutamine negates the effects of nitrix ? thanx


I like your idea in terms of muxing things up. I feel that while you NEED to go heavy, you cannot do that ALL of the time. Simply put, you cannot do the same thing all the time. As for glutmaine intake, I'm not a huge believer in supplementing my diet with free form L-Glutamine. It just doesn't seem to do much for me. And if it interferes with the effectiveness of a nitric oxide product (which I feel is far more worthwhile than L-glutamine supplementation) then that's all the more reason to go easy with it.

Ox
03-26-08, 3:04 pm
Ox,

I am fast approaching my show... I have done the keto thing and been very happy..but my question is what does your meal plan look like on thursday/friday to carb up?? Thanks

I do the same diet (except shakes are replaced with whole food) and I add 30g of carbs to each meal.

Ox
03-26-08, 3:07 pm
The juice from a lemon? Is it sugar, or is it acids? What I mean is...can I put lemon juice on my salmon or not (following a keto diet)? What about lemon juice added to my water?

Technically it does have sugar but if you wanted A squeeze on your salmon I wouldn't worry about it. But that doesn't mean I would use it all day long and in your water etc. From a methodological standpoint, you shouldn't use it. Will it fuck everything up? It shoudn't. But then again, I don't do that when I diet.

Ox
03-26-08, 3:08 pm
This food is delicious.. and thats a problem.. it makes me want more!

Thank you for all you've added to this forum with your thread and the minds you're changing with the "fat" movement.

Hopefully in 12 weeks or so I'll have some abs to show for it.

I'm glad you like it...keep me posted on your progress.

krazyassmexican
03-26-08, 3:09 pm
yo evan, long time no talk bro haha

just passed by to say what's up and to thank you one more time for everything you did for me on my last cut

Ox
03-26-08, 3:59 pm
yo evan, long time no talk bro haha

just passed by to say what's up and to thank you one more time for everything you did for me on my last cut

What's up Krazy? Good to hear from you buddy. Hope all is well. Peace.

Convery
03-26-08, 4:55 pm
Dear Ox,
My names Dave and im 16, 144 lb, stocky (5'6) and built, and have been liftin for about a year or so, but havent gotten serious until about a month or two ago. Im an idiot and i wanna know the right things to do before i find out the hard way. My gym teacher always critisizes me because i lift to fast and really try to humph stuff up if you know what i mean. He says that i should go slow and let the weight sit when its on top off me or applying the most pressure if that makes sense. like example, he says when benching, let the bar touch your chest, let it sit for 2 seconds, and then push it up slow and controled. and for leg presses he has me hold it when its on top of me for 2 seconds, then push it up slowly. i can feel this shredding my muscles, but im not sure if its giving me what i want. i have a pretty low BF percentage so theres no real reason for me to cut. will what my gym teacher says give me the bulking im looking for? or is humphing it up just doing the same thing? Sorry about such a long message, thanks for your time.
Dave

bovat
03-26-08, 5:02 pm
The macros look good but if you're just over 200 lbs then you can definitely get by with less carbs than that. Right now you're taking in about what I take in and I'm 280. I would keep the protein and the fat and rop the carbs back to 200g or so.

im so glad you said that, cuz 200 g of carbs is like the perfect amount to satisfy my hunger....and another thing, prolly top five sickest picks ever, is this one i saw of you curling, its on your homepage on the left...dopest biceps ive ever seen

Convery
03-27-08, 6:27 am
Dear Ox,
My names Dave and im 16, 144 lb, stocky (5'6) and built, and have been liftin for about a year or so, but havent gotten serious until about a month or two ago. Im an idiot and i wanna know the right things to do before i find out the hard way. My gym teacher always critisizes me because i lift to fast and really try to humph stuff up if you know what i mean. He says that i should go slow and let the weight sit when its on top off me or applying the most pressure if that makes sense. like example, he says when benching, let the bar touch your chest, let it sit for 2 seconds, and then push it up slow and controled. and for leg presses he has me hold it when its on top of me for 2 seconds, then push it up slowly. i can feel this shredding my muscles, but im not sure if its giving me what i want. i have a pretty low BF percentage so theres no real reason for me to cut. will what my gym teacher says give me the bulking im looking for? or is humphing it up just doing the same thing? Sorry about such a long message, thanks for your time.
Dave

also, does doing things slow and controlled build muscle faster? or is it just so you dont get hurt?

RenegadeRows
03-28-08, 11:30 pm
Sup ox. just picked up a copy of the MD mag and you've blown up like fuckin crazy dude... just awsome. Your back looks fuckin wikkid in those shots they have of you with the back training article.

One question though, how do you add width to your back? I am trying to add some size to my lats... I'll be honest, I cant do a single pulldown, but I will tear the shit out of the pulldowns. I heard that was the only way to add size...any other suggestions besides these two exercises? what rep ranges/number of sets do you recommend?

RenegadeRows
03-29-08, 9:43 am
...dont mean to spam Ox bro but another thought... I am 230 lbs with 12% bf (caliper tested) and went on the keto (your high fat/high protein diet) thing to lean up for the summer. I have never done keto before and I am into day 4 of it. I feel like shit, my lifts have gone down, I have headaches the size of china all the time, and I just feel slow and sleepy 24/7. Am I suppose to feel this on the first week or so? I am doing 310g protien and 140g fat. I have lost 2 lbs already. What am i doing wrong Ev?

Lowdown5
03-29-08, 10:43 am
...dont mean to spam Ox bro but another thought... I am 230 lbs with 12% bf (caliper tested) and went on the keto (your high fat/high protein diet) thing to lean up for the summer. I have never done keto before and I am into day 4 of it. I feel like shit, my lifts have gone down, I have headaches the size of china all the time, and I just feel slow and sleepy 24/7. Am I suppose to feel this on the first week or so? I am doing 310g protien and 140g fat. I have lost 2 lbs already. What am i doing wrong Ev?


Evan talked about this in the Cage, you are doing everything right. Your body is switching from burning carbs for energy and to support brain function to using ketones and bodyfat. In a day or so you will feel great, trust me.

**Evan, sorry for stealing your thunder here.**

simpleguy
03-29-08, 10:51 am
Evan talked about this in the Cage, you are doing everything right. Your body is switching from burning carbs for energy and to support brain function to using ketones and bodyfat. In a day or so you will feel great, trust me.

**Evan, sorry for stealing your thunder here.**

agreed.... wait for a day or two Renegade... and watch those carbs carefully

RenegadeRows
03-29-08, 12:53 pm
yeah dude...carbs were down to like 20-30g and fat was way up. I bought these eggs (egglands) that are high in omega-3s...damn things have 4.5g of fat PER egg...fuckin awsome.

Lowdown5
03-29-08, 12:55 pm
yeah dude...carbs were down to like 20-30g and fat was way up. I bought these eggs (egglands) that are high in omega-3s...damn things have 4.5g of fat PER egg...fuckin awsome.


Don't sweat the fat in the eggs, it won't hurt you at all.

herdz
03-29-08, 2:19 pm
Yo ox, is it even possible to add lean muscle while on keto?? or am i crazy to do that in the off season.....

born0withno0soul
03-30-08, 12:27 am
ox what do you eat to carb up before the show and how much. also what do you eat right before prejudging as well as between prejudging and the night show

Thetasteofink69
03-30-08, 1:01 pm
Hey man.. Just wanted to say congratulations for getting on the cover of MD

I read your articles about arm training.. They were badass..

Anyway.. Congrats again

mark_Lamb
03-30-08, 4:20 pm
ox i was just curious as to what your water intake is like lets say the last week leading up to a contest. Im hearing a ton of stuff of how to cut your water before the comp can you help me out here bro and also what do you do to carb up?

calcaneous
03-30-08, 11:18 pm
im going to start this diet very soon. I dont want to start the calories out too low right off the bat, do you think starting around 2,500 calories is a bad idea? i weigh in at around 200lbs and im guessing between 10-12% bodyfat.

Im going to start at 2,500, and then lower the calories down to hit my "cutting" amount.

Ox
03-31-08, 11:23 am
Dear Ox,
My names Dave and im 16, 144 lb, stocky (5'6) and built, and have been liftin for about a year or so, but havent gotten serious until about a month or two ago. Im an idiot and i wanna know the right things to do before i find out the hard way. My gym teacher always critisizes me because i lift to fast and really try to humph stuff up if you know what i mean. He says that i should go slow and let the weight sit when its on top off me or applying the most pressure if that makes sense. like example, he says when benching, let the bar touch your chest, let it sit for 2 seconds, and then push it up slow and controled. and for leg presses he has me hold it when its on top of me for 2 seconds, then push it up slowly. i can feel this shredding my muscles, but im not sure if its giving me what i want. i have a pretty low BF percentage so theres no real reason for me to cut. will what my gym teacher says give me the bulking im looking for? or is humphing it up just doing the same thing? Sorry about such a long message, thanks for your time.
Dave


Dave-

I think that for the most part your gym teacher is right. What he's saying is not to use momentum and I agree with him. By going slow you not only are taking momentum out of the equation and recruiing more muscle fibers but you will also increase the time the muscle is under tension. Theoretically, if a slow set lasts one minute as opposed to a set lasting ten seconds, you're gonna fry the muscle that muscle more as well as tap into your cetral nervous system. In short, slow it down. Use the weights to work the muscle, don't use your muscles to work the weights.

Ox
03-31-08, 11:24 am
im so glad you said that, cuz 200 g of carbs is like the perfect amount to satisfy my hunger....and another thing, prolly top five sickest picks ever, is this one i saw of you curling, its on your homepage on the left...dopest biceps ive ever seen

Thanks buddy. That's one of my favorite pics too.

Enforcer
03-31-08, 11:26 am
Hey Evan- me, you, and Mike D- Surf Club this summer- no excuses