How to influence others, gain power, maximize wealth, and not die

[NJC_Manhattan]

Ladies and Gentlemen,

At one point or another, man contemplates his own mortality. The first time it happens is generally around 12-13 years of age, when the brain becomes fully aware of Death and that feeling of immortality and careless of our youth is somewhat curbed. Occasionally we are reminded of how fragile people are; major tragedies, accidents, etc. and it gives that bittersweet chill of yes we are alive, but how quickly we can diminish into nothingness is astounding to say the least.

With that being said, people find solace in striving for immortality, or a legacy of sorts. Some find it vicariously through their children. Others are talked about today as if they were still alive (just this morning I read a retrospective on Ben Franklin... The author wrote in present tense as if to suggest Ben was still roaming the earth). The worst fate a man can endure is to disappear, it's as if he or she had never existed, that is to truly die. Even if one is remembered poorly, that person still lives on in some way.

Now on to the fun stuff, after years of education, working in a field that all of America hates (finance... I know, I know control yourself), traveling (living in Europe/China/Japan for periods of longer than 6 months), meeting people (almost getting married... dodged a bullet on that one), I find myself wanted to work towards my own immortality. For a while, I concentrated on myself, and I thought this was the best means to meet my end. That narcissism, however, is incorrect. A man is truly great, if he makes others feel that they too can become great. So in time perhaps I can become immortal through those I influence... So how do we do that?

And so begins an open discussion on the components of power, influence, true wealth (happiness, success, and meaning), and last--but certainly not least--how to not die.

[Firefist]

exellent topic.

i think about this alot. immoratlity is achieved in so many ways, the random acts of kindness one does in a day, volunteering yourself to organizations to help others. hell for us, teaching a newbie proper form, diet etc. Those people become affected by what we do, perhaps that person you helped had no means of shelter and you donated your time to habitats for humanity, or mabye that one guy you motivated to train would turn out to become an IFBB pro, (brian dobson and branch warren). its the little things that truly make a big difference.

i know that was just a small piece of the pie of immortality, theres so much to it.

I think of it this way, (trying to stray away from religion as much as possible to not offend individuals). Say God created man. Why did he not just make one person? We are all here to help each other.

true wealth is not material possesions, awards, power.

Its the journey, the knowlege you learn from people you meet, the experiences you have, and the people you affect.

theres no better feeling in the world than helping someone and being thanked for it. thats wealth to me.

[NJC_Manhattan]

I agree... Thanks for the post...

I also want to make clear, that this is not a religious thing... Every man from any background/faith has contemplated this at least once in his/her life.

[NJC_Manhattan]

I do believe random acts of kindness are one part of this, but it expands to help society as a whole... There are also times where man is faced with ethically complex situations, that demand the most of his character... For example...


Let's say for sake of argument that you are a super hero, you can do practically anything. Now let's say that you are standing between two lakes, one has 5 people in it drowning, one has 3 people in it drowning. You can only save one lake. You do not know any of these people, so which do you choose?

Most people would choose the 5 because they are saving more lives and letting the others die

Now consider this scenario....

You are the same super hero, you are riding on a train towards a lake of 5 people drowning. Holding the railway tracks together over a gap is one man. You can either kill that one man and save the 5, or let the 5 die and save the one. Which do you choose?

This is significantly harder to answer than the first scenario. Why? In the first you are letting people die, you aren't actually killing them to save the 5. In the second scenario, your direct action would kill someone, but you would be saving 5 lives.

Thus comes the killing vs. letting die distinction. And it is one of the most significant ethical discussions. You can bring countless examples for this...

Don't let this fuck with your head, the distinction was developed by PHDs way before my time, and is studied even today.

[NJC_Manhattan]

Have you ever had this happen to you? You're doing laundry, and you pull a pair of pants out and check the pockets and find a $20 dollar bill. If you're anything like me, youll take that twenty and carelessly spend it on something (for me it would probably be a dvd). Yet, that $20 dollars could feed a small town for a day, or prevent a child from going blind. So why don't I donate that money?

I can't use the argument, oh they are so far away. Why? If I saw a baby lying face down choking, but I was 10 feet away as opposed to another person 5 feet away, does that mean I am not responsible, but the other person is because he/she is closer? Absolutely not.

But still, why don't I give the money away?

[GJN5002]

Im reminded almost everyday. I work for the government witht he social security admisinistration. I take care of the unfortunate people that come in when their spouse dies and also people who come in because they can no longer work due to injuries and illness. It has really opened my eyes and made me want to live a fuller life. Ive really been into eating better lately. Not that I dont eat well, but there is so much more that goes into understanding what food does to the body and how organic foods are produced in comparison to many of the industrially produced products we consume.

[NJC_Manhattan]

Thanks for the post bro

[Bartles]

Thanks for the post bro

Why do I have the feeling that this thread is helping someone do their research paper?

Anyhow, to live "forever" I'd say that being in a persons thoughts and being remembered allows you to still affect people. If you are affecting people, then you are changing the world, if you are changing the world, how are you not still living?

Think of the whole, "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

Better yet, does that sound matter? If you live life and you do not impact, or even make a ripple in the ocean that the world is, then are you living? You certainly are not living eternally if you are not making a sound.

Can something exist without being perceived?
Yes it can, but does it matter? Nothing matters unless it affects you.

Good thread, always great to see how other Animals think.

[NJC_Manhattan]

Why do I have the feeling that this thread is helping someone do their research paper?

Anyhow, to live "forever" I'd say that being in a persons thoughts and being remembered allows you to still affect people. If you are affecting people, then you are changing the world, if you are changing the world, how are you not still living?

Think of the whole, "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?"

Better yet, does that sound matter? If you live life and you do not impact, or even make a ripple in the ocean that the world is, then are you living? You certainly are not living eternally if you are not making a sound.

Can something exist without being perceived?
Yes it can, but does it matter? Nothing matters unless it affects you.

Good thread, always great to see how other Animals think.

Lol on the research paper.

You sir, are touching on tons of different material. Being remembered is certainly one way to live on. But by how many? And by whom? Do those both matter? I'd like to think not, but it is one thing to be remembered by a nation than remembered by a mute person. Meaning, immortality must be sung to the living. The greater the number, the longer the immortality.

With the whole tree thing... On one hand, sound needs a receiver in order for the original vibration wave to collapse, thus resulting in sound. So in this case no. On the other hand, the tree still creates the initial vibration and no receiver does not negate that initial sound origin.

With the whole ocean thing... Many writers have touched in this. Most notably Virginia Woolf in her novel The Waves. Time is consistent like the waves of the ocean, cyclical, never-ending, static and self-fulfilling. If we choose the ocean metaphor for life, then what we do has little meaning in terms of the world/time. But what is important is the influence of others on the self. Basically, interactions/relationships with others. We deduce this from our growing/changing with that that does not grow/change and we help fulfill our desire through others that are poised with the same condition.

Your last two question....

Can something exist without being perceived?
Yes it can, but does it matter? Nothing matters unless it affects you.

If something exists, then it has already been perceived to exist. Things that do not exist, cannot be perceived, but only speculated, upon. Things that do not effect you can matter. Let's say a child is born today in England, I do not know the family or the child, and will probably never interact with the family/child. I can't possibly conclude that the child doesn't matter because it doesn't effect me. Can I?

Thanks for your post

[NJC_Manhattan]

Sounds like a simple concept, but you'd be amazed at how many people ignore this.

Example;
You ever have the friend that everyone thinks is funny, but all his jokes come from movies/tv/standup. I got a buddy like that that went from quoting Old School, to Anchorman, to the Office, etc. It's totally unoriginal, and it's the last thing you want to be remembered for.

Example;
A person who reads an opinion article or watches the news, and all of a sudden that is their opinion. This is a light form of brainwashing.

Example;
Mob mentality. People who just go with the crowd and refuse to lead.

I'm sure you can think up your own.

Thinking for yourself is an interesting concept. Some say it's impossible. You learned everything you know from others. It's hard to contribute something truly original. I, however, slightly disagree. Why?

A person's personality is partly made up by the world around him/her and the people around him/her. Yet we conceptualize our 'self' in our own way. Thus we do think for ourselves.

Bottom line:
Don't buy the bullshit. Simple and true.

[NJC_Manhattan]

Yes it can be done.

One of my friends got into an Ivy (I will keep it anonymous... PM me if you want the name) with a 2.3/4.0 out of high school and a low SAT (1000/1600... I know the scores are different now). He is not a dumb person, just kinda lazy. So how did he do it???

Come junior year, he made weekend trips to the Ivy on the regular. He met with Professors and discussed classes, went to speeches held at the school, networked with alumni and current students, set up meetings with the dean of faculty, dean of students, and the President. At the end of his junior year he was getting emails from the Ivy, had made contacts, and some friends. When it came time to apply, he wrote his personal statement on his experience at the Ivy the previous year.

After his application was in, he personally called faculty and the deans to thank them for their help during this process and informed them that he had applied for early decision. He conveyed that he had enough information and really enjoyed the community. They wrote back that they hoped he'd get in and said he would be a good fit for the community.

A week later, he spent a full weekend at the Ivy. Did he go out and get "hella fucked up" or get "mad laid". No. He interviewed daily. Even in casual conversation he expressed his talents.

The kid is a born talker.

Results? He got early acceptance. His school range set by his grades was no where near the level of this school. I was shocked and asked him how to do it.

Lesson? If you really want something, fucking prove it. Get involved, talk with people, go to events, get yourself so integrated in the system that the system needs you.

[NJC_Manhattan]

Sometimes it seems impossible.

If you don't understand finance, accounting, and the use of credit, then getting out debt seems pretty hard. Here are a few tips to help ya out.

-Basis points: is 1/100 of a percent. If you contact your debtor and ask for your rate to be lowered 5 to 10 basis points, they will probably do that for you. Granted, you can't be a delinquent payer. You can do this once every six months. They will probably work for you. Especially during this crisis, they want to make sure everyone can pay.

-Taxes: Deduct student interest rate that you paid. Deduct anything you had to buy for work (suits/ties not included). Set up your W-2 so that you don't pay any taxes until tax season. Invest that money in a secure bond whose yield (rate of return, interest rate, whatever) is high enough so you will have the money to pay back taxes and make some money on the side.

-Home equity: Leverage against your house. Yea I said it. Having equity just sitting in your home, is like burying money in your backyard. Yea you have it, but its not working for you.

-Borrow from your family: if they are sticklers, draft up a legal doc. Always good to keep money in your family.

-Negotiate, negotiate, negotiate: Very few times does the price advertised, mean the price you have to pay. Talk with people. You can always come to a bargain or some kind of payment plan.

-Make friends with an accountant: This has saved me thousands...

-Never get a store credit card: You know this garbage like a sears card or some shit. The interest rates and through the roof and the points earned never equal what you pay to have the card.

Just FYI.

[TheHardGainer]

Nice posts. I'm headin off to college in a couple of months and will DEFINITLY remember these tips. Keep em comin.

[Gambit]

I'm liking some of your thought processes, NJC. Some real shit being spoken.

Really digging this...looking forward to some top-notch discussions happening...



I got a question for you. It's a matter of semantics. Why do we say "My body is sore today." Why do we not say "I am sore today" instead? Where's the breach of consciousness?

[NJC_Manhattan]

Nice posts. I'm headin off to college in a couple of months and will DEFINITLY remember these tips. Keep em comin.

Thanks man.

For college, know that it is a lot easier to transfer to a better school once you are already in college. If your first semester sucks, apply to the top places. Your chances of getting in are greatly improved.

[NJC_Manhattan]

I'm liking some of your thought processes, NJC. Some real shit being spoken.

Really digging this...looking forward to some top-notch debates in here

Thanks man.

Like your posts as well.

[NJC_Manhattan]

I got a question for you. It's a matter of semantics. Why do we say "My body is sore today." Why do we not say "I am sore today" instead? Where's the breach of consciousness?

Semantics is the study and classification of changes in the signification of words or forms viewed as factors of linguistic development (as defined by Websters). Do you mean Semiotic? a branch dealing with relations between signs and what they refer to?

Regardless, the first question you bring up is fragmentation. The mind can group/pinpoint things in parts. Saying "My body is sore today" is normal, saying "I am sore today" could describe your current state of mind, state of being, or overall feeling. Though, people could say either and we would probably receive them correctly. It could just be a matter of preference.

Your second question, you need to bare with me because you are touching on the unity of consciousness set out by Immanuel Kant (Philosopher). Human beings are in a single conscious state at all times. For example, let's say you hear something and touch something at the same time, one is not conscious of the noise and, separately, of the touch. They are unified. Neuropsychology studies the relationship between the brains interaction with the outside world and consciousness. The unified consciousness are brain bisection operations. The questions are, however, how many centres of consciousness do people have? Meaning, one person's consciousness given X stimulant will probably not be an exact match to another person's when exposed to X stimulant. A second question is partial unity possible? Meaning, unified consciousness assumes that unification can happen at a specific time. So what about across time? That consciousness might be a way to unite earloer cognitive states.

[Gambit]

I wondered if you were gonna bring Kant into this conversation! haha

[TheHardGainer]

Thanks man.

For college, know that it is a lot easier to transfer to a better school once you are already in college. If your first semester sucks, apply to the top places. Your chances of getting in are greatly improved.

I will definitely remember that, thank you

[NJC_Manhattan]

I will definitely remember that, thank you

No worries